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Post by Ativan Prescribed on Apr 27, 2015 8:21:14 GMT 8
I see my endo pretty soon, and the time goes by pretty quickly, but she has always been good at answering questions I have concerning myself. This is kinda like you in that respect, finding what we need for ourselves. I think it might be because of the confusion and different this and that, and the should or not provide information thing. After not looking for this kind of information, the equivalency stuff for some time, I was disappointed to see that the same old stuff from several years ago was right there again. I did start to look into s few different areas, by way of key search words, but it really seems there is nothing of much of a real answer to transgender questions. My endo is a contributor to the SOC and might have a few places to look that just aren't showing up on searches. I'll make a point of asking her. Over the years, her answers have changed as new and better information has become available. Mainly, she just wants to make sure that I'm still healthy, and I do have some recent labs to go over, but I'll see if I can find something from her as far as a good source of information. I think there is going to be a lot more information coming along soon, the younger generations sure could use whatever is available. To many generations have had to deal with a real lack of available knowledge on hormones. It is tricky stuff, to be sure, there are too many different hormones that the body relies on having in balance. people should be able to walk into their Dr's office and have a conversation about available options, and they should be able to bring that information along with them. Better treatments, less guessing if there might be a better way, knowing what to look for in the event that things are going wrong, making sure that less things can go wrong.
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Post by Dani on Apr 27, 2015 14:04:35 GMT 8
Did you try the link I put in my last post? It is a veritable wealth of information, they are right there on the front lines. I have become fairly armed in the info area, so when I see my new Dr. for the second time, and can discuss things in more depth, rather than the getting background stuff, I'll know exactly where I stand. It is kind of funny though, I had made sure with my last Dr. that my ass was covered, so even before getting a new script from this new Dr., I already had enough vials of E 'at home' to last me through Sept of 2015. All is good, Dani
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Post by Ativan Prescribed on Apr 28, 2015 1:04:31 GMT 8
I have an ample supply of what I need as well, at least a few months worth. A person just never knows. I did indeed look at the link. It is my understanding that they are one of the leaders in trans care in that area of the country. I'll see what I can come up with next month when I see both my psychologist and Dr at the center I go to. There is much to catch up on, I'm sure. I know a lot of research has been going on, it's just a matter of collaboration from their peers to make new and relevant information available. I am guilty of not keeping up on it for the last couple years. I'll post anything of interest that I find out.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2015 14:37:49 GMT 8
Any questions about hormones etc feel.free... I am nb mtf. At what point does the skin stop softening? Mine is pretty soft now, but not soft enough, in my opinion.
Overall, at what point (generally) does everything start to trail off and stay in one zone?
That's all I can think of at the moment.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2015 19:18:20 GMT 8
Any questions about hormones etc feel.free... I am nb mtf. At what point does the skin stop softening? Mine is pretty soft now, but not soft enough, in my opinion.
Overall, at what point (generally) does everything start to trail off and stay in one zone?
That's all I can think of at the moment.Your milage may vary. Shan used to say it keeps on getting better over the years for an mtf full hormonal. At 6 months, I had most of my boobs, was seeing fat move. At two years, I am a woman with an extra in body. Yet, each month, I still see subtle changes. Nice changes. Take your body fat up a notch, you'll see it now. Trin
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2015 10:51:40 GMT 8
Didn't answer the question.
I think it's yeah. You'll get softer, and your hair changes, which helps that.
Leg hair removal, and it's method, that too. I use an epilator, which hurts, but is paying off.
Also use moisturizer.
It should just keep getting better dear.
Trinity Satin Joy
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2015 10:53:15 GMT 8
Plateaus, dunno. 2 years?
Dunno.
Trin
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2015 6:14:13 GMT 8
I started on Finasteride today, finally.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2015 19:13:05 GMT 8
So how's it feel Erin?
I completed 2 yrs hrt may 25.
34 under the breast, 36 when measured above, that's up an inch,from 2 months ago and I think there'd transition stuff continuing, 37 across the nips.
Waist 32. Hips 37.
Legs look great, belly issbetter. Still have muscle definition in the arms, I was strong as iron at hrt start up, very little fat.
Start up was 138 lbs 5 8. After cutting 35 pounds. Currently 148. Body fat is girl fat. Had bph before hrt...a search on prostate meds led me to finesteride and then here.
Still have bph but it's better, at my prostate exam yesterday the doc said it had shrunk to almost nothing.
High serums, range 350 low to ? On e cypionate injection once a week, 2.5 cc. Very high dose, 200mg Spiro, 5 mg finesteride.
Orchi ruled out yesterday as not needed not advisable, I agree. Srs also not practical or advised.
I wanted bigger boobs and fat movement over the next 5 years will get me there.
I'm pretty happy about all this.
Trinity
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2015 19:52:35 GMT 8
I hate injecting through a nerve...
Ow.
Either hurts, or doesn't, I never know...
Stuffs already hitting. Still acts like a tranquilizer for me.
Blessings
Trinity
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Post by Dani on Oct 19, 2015 4:21:10 GMT 8
Hi Everyone, gosh it has been awhile since coming here. Been very busy around home and getting cast out of another garden . I am doing well and enjoying life, hrt is proceeding well. So here is my question: In researching into another area, I seem to be dead-ended by an area of understanding that I am inadequite in, and cannot move forward until I have this info. This involves Progesterone receptors (PR's) and Estrogen receptors (ER's). Are genetic cis men born with the same amount of PR's as cis women? If PR's are in shortage during hrt, does progesterone have the ability to attach and use ER's? If they can does this mean progesterone can essentially 'crowd out' so to speak and use ER's that would normally be used by the Estradiol? And if this can happen, would an increase in Estradiol dosage be sort of futile unless there was a decrease in Progesterone? I ask this as I am researching nutrition and breast growth, the biochemistry side of it. I just would like the stage set with the best actors in place in order to gain the perfect 'play'. I believe strength of success is limited only by the weakest link. I am finding some extrodinarily good results using regular intakes of premium canned salmon, ultra pure and fresh olive oils, quality aged balsalmic vinager, good sleep, exercise, lots of water, and an overall nutritional balance. With that said, one would think, ok so what is the problem? Well I've spent a year at one Estradiol dosage level, 6 to 7 months now at the next increased level, and I am knocking on the door of probably my last good strong increase. I added 100mg/day of Prometrium in late May, bumped it to 200 mg/day in late June, and all seems to be going well. I just wanted to know that with my new increase of E, I'm not wasting it by any possible interference of the Progesterone. In a vague way I remember reading somewhere that Progesterone does indeed compete for ER's, but search after search has yielded zip. A link would be extra extra cool. Well thanks in advace, and I hope you all are as happy as possible for whatever your going through. Luv, Dani
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Dani
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Post by Dani on Oct 21, 2015 23:26:04 GMT 8
Hi Everyone, gosh it has been awhile since coming here. Been very busy around home and getting cast out of another garden . I am doing well and enjoying life, hrt is proceeding well. So here is my question: In researching into another area, I seem to be dead-ended by an area of understanding that I am inadequite in, and cannot move forward until I have this info. This involves Progesterone receptors (PR's) and Estrogen receptors (ER's). Are genetic cis men born with the same amount of PR's as cis women? If PR's are in shortage during hrt, does progesterone have the ability to attach and use ER's? If they can does this mean progesterone can essentially 'crowd out' so to speak and use ER's that would normally be used by the Estradiol? And if this can happen, would an increase in Estradiol dosage be sort of futile unless there was a decrease in Progesterone? I ask this as I am researching nutrition and breast growth, the biochemistry side of it. I just would like the stage set with the best actors in place in order to gain the perfect 'play'. I believe strength of success is limited only by the weakest link. I am finding some extrodinarily good results using regular intakes of premium canned salmon, ultra pure and fresh olive oils, quality aged balsalmic vinager, good sleep, exercise, lots of water, and an overall nutritional balance. With that said, one would think, ok so what is the problem? Well I've spent a year at one Estradiol dosage level, 6 to 7 months now at the next increased level, and I am knocking on the door of probably my last good strong increase. I added 100mg/day of Prometrium in late May, bumped it to 200 mg/day in late June, and all seems to be going well. I just wanted to know that with my new increase of E, I'm not wasting it by any possible interference of the Progesterone. In a vague way I remember reading somewhere that Progesterone does indeed compete for ER's, but search after search has yielded zip. A link would be extra extra cool. Well thanks in advace, and I hope you all are as happy as possible for whatever your going through. Luv, Dani Well I guess with 11 1/2 pages of posts I'm gonna figure no one knows this answer, so I'll return to the ole google machine and try different routes. Thanks Anyways, Dani
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2015 0:05:17 GMT 8
Sorry about that
Yeah i have no idea.
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Post by EchelonHunt on Oct 22, 2015 1:12:36 GMT 8
Well I guess with 11 1/2 pages of posts I'm gonna figure no one knows this answer, so I'll return to the ole google machine and try different routes. Thanks Anyways, Dani I don't think there will be a such thing as a clear-cut answer to the questions you are asking, it is something that is not frequently studied so the specifics of your questions aren't going to be fully answered. That may be something you might have to accept. I think even the experts in the field wouldn't be able to give 100% definitive answers. There are some things that just cannot be explained away by cold hard scientific facts, yes, even science will come up short, hit a roadblock, have doctors scratching their head mindlessly. Hormones and genetics is one of those things that is like a slippery slope. We do not know everything there is to know about hormones and genetics. There are even parts inside the brain that remain a total medical mystery. However, I did find the following, whether it helps or not is the big question. "This Australian and American study compared 112 male to female transsexuals to 258 control males. They looked at genes for androgen receptor, estrogen receptor beta, and aromatase. No differences were found for the estrogen receptor or aromatase, but transsexuals had longer repeat lengths for the androgen receptor allele.
“This study provides evidence that male gender identity might be partly mediated through the androgen receptor.” "A small Austrian study found an association between gender dysphoria and a different gene related to converting progesterone into androgens. Nobody else has looked at this gene."
"Three studies found no difference in the gene for androgen receptor, including one study of over 400 trans women.
III. An Italian study that looked at the Y chromosome found no differences between trans women and control males.
IV. An Austrian study that looked at sex chromosomes in trans women and trans men found no significant abnormalities.
V. A Japanese study that looked at genes related to estrogen receptor alpha and progesterone receptor found no differences between the genes of male to female transsexuals and male controls or the genes of female to male transsexuals and female controls. This study also looked at estrogen receptor β, androgen receptor, and CYP19A1 and found no differences for those genes either; this is one of the studies discussed above.
VI. An Austrian study of a gene related to steroid 5-alpha reductase (SRD5A2) found no differences between trans women, trans men, and male and female controls. SRD5A2 is involved in the conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone.
It is important to remember that there may be some other genetic variations that are linked to gender dysphoria in trans women, something that we haven’t studied yet.""This Japanese study compared 74 male-to-female transsexuals, 168 female-to-male transsexuals, 106 male controls, and 169 female controls. They looked at genes for androgen receptor, estrogen receptors alpha and beta, aromatase, and progesterone receptor.
They found no differences between the genes of male to female transsexuals and male controls or the genes of female to male transsexuals and female controls.
“The present findings do not provide any evidence that genetic variants of sex hormone-related genes confer individual susceptibility to MTF or FTM transsexualism.”"This study looked at a different gene from the other studies, CYP17. CYP17 encodes cytochrome, an enzyme involved in converting progesterone and pregnenolone into androgens.
The authors found that a particular mutation of this gene, CYP17 −34 T>C, was associated with female to male transsexualism, but not male to female transsexualism.
They also found that, “the CYP17 −34 T>C allele distribution was gender-specific among controls. The MtF transsexuals had an allele distribution equivalent to male controls, whereas the FtM transsexuals did not follow the gender-specific allele distribution of female controls but rather had an allele distribution equivalent to MtF transsexuals and male controls.”
In other words, trans men and trans women were similar to male controls and not female controls.
They point out, however, that there were women without gender dysphoria who had the mutant allele as well as women with gender dysphoria who did not have it. “Thus, carriage of the mutant CYP17 T−34C SNP C allele is neither necessary nor sufficient for developing transsexualism.”
In other words, there must be other genetic or environmental factors involved."From weblink, Genes & Gender DysphoriaI hope it helps somewhat.
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Post by Ativan Prescribed on Oct 22, 2015 2:17:48 GMT 8
I think it falls under the same thing as receptors that stuff like depression fall under. Which deal with the hormones associated with them. There are how many hormones and receptors for them? Yah you'd think there'd be something specific, I do as well. But even in the much studied realm of depression, there are so many variables to take into account, different ways that different levels interact, even the different ways receptors react in efficiency, number and size, there are very hard to find definitive answers. I've looked until I have given up on the answers for the depression side of the story, as well as the ones that we deal with the most as trans. Most of the information out there are studies done for cis woman, and some of it cam be interpreted to trans, some extrapolated, but it's not definitive. My Dr is multiple PhD who publishes her own results for her studies with trans and related, and those publications are full of references to yet other ones that can be and are dated in amount and accuracy of information. Much of the discussions that are centered around how it all works are pretty much seat of the pants flying through cloudy information. I think compiled information of peoples varied experiences can give just as accurate information and in a lot of ways, there's more of it there. It takes grant money to get most studies off the ground, more once initial information is presented and even then, you have to find a large enough group of people willing to hand out grant money to get studies done. It's really why you find studies that seem to be repeated over and over, because of interests in one area over another, despite that they have more than enough information and can move on to other things. It comes down to who has control over the money in most cases. Like right now, it's really easy to get grant money for studies dealing with brain scans, a popular thing that seems to hold more interest for now. Information gleamed from one study or series of scans can and is used to compile an incomplete answer to yet other questions, until there is direct interest and backing, those scans won't happen for more specific studies. Look at the references for a lot of information and you can see ho much of it comes from other loosely related work done at some other time. Go look at wikiwhatever and check the references under most everything and you find a lot of very dated and suspect sources of information. Even the SOC is like that, it's based on a lot of different findings, it's a standard of care, not a scientific paper, but it's based on a lot of published studies and those are based on what can be very dated information. It's always in flux and in need of revision as new and better information becomes available, it's just a matter of if and when it does become available. I have publish information that is based on other information and it has been used for yet others information, on totally unrelated things, but the process is the same. it takes some really groundbreaking stuff to be able to even get studies going, and my work was considered just that at the time, but the further studies I wanted to do were turned down in favor of different ones that were competitive by colleagues in the very same building. I left the industry over that and also what my work was used for, not what I had intended it to be used for. It's that kind of a dog eat dog world in competitive scientific studies. Most of it is done by undergrads in colleges, with DoD backing. Our military industrial complex spend more money than any other field out there. The scientific world has a way of slowly moving around in pretty much a big series of circles that just kinda spiral up in real world applications, it moves up generally when someone actually hits on something big or groundbreaking and then that holds attention until it either settles back into the groove or unless the next big thing comes along. Some very smart people can easily lose their tenure because they missed out on getting enough grant money for their projects. Right now, trans is the darling of the media that depends on ad money to exist, we're still just a blip in the sciences, but that blip is getting bigger each year, so...
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