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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2014 20:48:41 GMT 8
Tough subject, tough thread coming. i like to ask the hard questions, why pretend its a walk in the park to be trans. it is not.
A question you may not wish to answer. Dont if it hurts to much, just stop reading.
How much self deception and rationalization comes due to not wishing to address the consequences of hitting the wall and accepting our transsexuality or other transness?
How many were taken out by it?
I live personally in an effort to reduce as much collateral damage as possible without destroying myself in the process. When its too much, the phones will ring, the tears fall, the day gotten through to the other side. Forming ever deeper bonds with all of you.
Lot of self esteem can come from this.... lot of low self esteem can come from not being able to do it, and that isnt appropriate either since dysphoria can break a mind like a twig.
I had a rather shitty and transparent conversation, or maybe confrontation, with my eldest daughter last night who I dearly love and who simply cannot see her father change in front of her eyes, the personality shifting, the body, the trigger was the mascara. I need the ........ mascara, once I give an inch to dyphoria it is always a point of no return. They say you can dial back if you over present. I cannot. But I can wash my face before leaving work. I validate the face all day long, by focussing on the eyes and transitioned face under the beard-mask, and with the mascara that is so much easier. And so in your face trans.
So, will that cause additional collateral damage? My wife has not spotted it yet.
Presentations for me are gently and ever so slowly allowed to push the boundaries. My shrink is concerned that i cannot hold boundaries, so am I, Patty helps me every day to do it with her wonderful encouragement. Can I hold to GQ? My daughter asked that last night. Its the question that consumes me, that I ruminate on, that you are all probably getting tired of hearing about. Why can't I just settle on the answer is "yes I can stay GQ for life"? Might have to do with a blonde that kept telling me my transition is inevitable. My mind and therapist can say no, but my dysphoria siezed that dart, and it has made my pain levels redline many, many times.
I hope my mind, my therapist, and Patty are right, and my heart and fear are wrong. But I can most assuredly get through this day without pushing the boundaries farther, thats all I know, I know nothing else.
I was asked once by a dear friend that supports my decisions here how long I could take this, how long I could continue to bear up under it. My answer was "until I go to sleep tonight." I know the tool, that is an AA tool, the secret to outlasting a blinding booze battle, to live one more day.
All of this is for the sake of mitigating collateral damage to family, to me personally in terms of job issues, of safety issues. Of keeping collateral damage from costing me my house, health, sobriety, life... based on one moment with a razor. I live day to day knowing I can destroy my current life with a simple shave, and being tempted by it all the time....
So I personally choose the harder path, the road less travelled. And I know so very clearly that some of us simply cannot do this same path that I choose to walk, they are not equipped with 30 years of fighting alchohol and drugs, they may not have the core wiring straight to the God of my understanding and allegience - believe me He does have my transition under His care and guidance - and thier dysphoria may be more accute than mine, mine is largely physical, and the body can be hidden. And flirted with using partial revelation like thin silk shirts... oh my.
Thoughts dear ones on this, cry it out, celebrate your victories, share the tools you use to minimize the damage in your own lives, or if you could not, celebrate the new life you are given by full transition in spite of the consequences. There are no wrong or right choices really, IMO, there is only dysphoria, and living with it as best as we can. For at the end of the day, that is what every single one of us is doing. Since we are still alive, we have done it well.
We all have this day. Lets live it to the very hilt of life, to the max of the joy of being us. Just for today.
Love you all my dears.
Nails out hair down eyes pretty and heart wide open
Trinity
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Post by Laura J on Dec 19, 2014 3:29:07 GMT 8
I thought about this overnight, read it several times, and reached what to me is acceptable in my life.
I have come to sense my trans self with much more sensitivity in the past weeks, and my most honest description is, my body feels more male oriented I think, but my mind, emotions, way of thinking is very much female. I find myself thinking as female without any notice, maybe that's why I keep changing, not so much to be more extreme trans, but to just catch up mentally and emotionally to my true self now. It is hard to distinguish and label and put into words, because its just my natural way of thinking, and I was looking for something inside me that stood out, and shouted trans, but I'm finding out just being me may just be my whole trans identity.?
But I find myself in different female moods, I love the clothes, adore the shoes, spend hours some days immersed in it on various website's..
I seem though, either to be lacking a strong desire to present differently, or I have not reached that point yet where I'm feeling a strong need to match my appearance to my emotional thoughts.?
Back to the specific topic, I feel similar in ways with Trinity, I have to minimize any collateral damage that my trans self may cause. When I got married I made several promises before God, and one was to never do or be any harm to my wife. I know very well that marriage is about sacrifice, by both spouses.
I can not do anything to myself that will cause undue stress or unhappiness upon my spouse, and she would never do that to me.
So is presenting more female going to cause undo stress at home.? How far should I go if I feel those insatiably urges.?
I can't tell you now.? I'm not to that point yet.
I know though, that if the day comes when my wife says, I can't do this anymore, goodbye, that will be like a domino, if it falls, every other part of my life will also topple over and be gone.. Preventing that, and protecting that, is my #1 priority in life, regardless what it does to me.
I'm afraid..
I don't want to hit that wall.. I don't want to hurt inside and be faced with this.
I know for you Trinity its a daily battle.. I can't tell you how much I admire the strength you show in dealing with your feelings.
It isn't all fun and games, this transgender stuff, its more difficult and painfully than most can even imagine..
Blessed be all of us.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 4:06:40 GMT 8
I really don't know if this collateral damage thing is limited to just trans issues. I just think it's one of the consequences that we face as humans making decisions. One of the the consequences of self expression. Just remember that collateral damage can be just as much a consequence to you and your psyche too. Marriage vows and being true is an extremely nobel thing but if it becomes unbearable to a person and makes a person unhappy and depressed all the time, how can you make someone else happy? I gave a marriage up. I was extremely unhappy having to stifle my self expression and my unhappines affected her and made her miserable and unhappy. Yeah after a little greiving on both sides, she is happy with someone else and I am happy being me.
My situation was a little different becuase there were no children involved. Just me and her. Children do make it a little more complicated and they are people too so they will have preconcieved notions and some will accept and others can't. Maybe in time they can. Usually shock is the first thing and someone they expect turns out to be totally different than their expectations is a shock.
Trinity, I have said this before and that is this has always been with us and has shaped who we are. Or for me anyway. Oh yeah some may have embraced it, others may have denied it, but in my case it has always been there. That is what made me ex fall in love with me in the first place. She was attracted to that part of me because we could be lovers and friends. I liked shopping with her. We liked the same movies. But when the realization of just who she fell in love with was presented to her, she couldn't take it. But I just couldn't supress my true self anymore so I had to let go. She couldn't love the real me anymore after I reavealed to her just who I was so she had to let go.
As for damage hon, just make sure you don't become damaged trying to prevent the collateral damage. If you can;t be happy then those around you won't be happy either. I don;t know how helpful this was but it was my situation and everyone's situations and circumstances are different.
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Post by Laura J on Dec 19, 2014 4:40:55 GMT 8
Thank you dearest Julie.. I promise.. I have your number, you can edit it out if you wish for your privacy. Love you.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 4:47:33 GMT 8
As for damage hon, just make sure you don't become damaged trying to prevent the collateral damage. If you can;t be happy then those around you won't be happy either. I don;t know how helpful this was but it was my situation and everyone's situations and circumstances are different. Spot on Jamie. Day at a time. If my wife sees it get to be too much, there would be an adjustment. Right now we are good, and I am flipping her on top tonight and letting Sh'e out, I am too... Oh my... Oh dear.... Oh....wow :-)
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 4:59:07 GMT 8
Seriously I will be very female presenting, just no wig, I will have my legs spread and I will have about ten female booms tonight with my woman. Patience is paying off...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 6:03:03 GMT 8
Thank you dearest Julie.. I promise.. I have your number, you can edit it out if you wish for your privacy. Love you. Thank You. Privacy is overrated. Dr. Bob Smith once said that we should never be so anonymous as to be unable to be found by someone in crisis. Call me anytime. Peace Julie Come to the aa meetings I am at. We can help. I can help. Julie's words are wise she is more available than I, and don't let me trigger you. I am big time mtf...you are a babe yet, and as stated, you can contact my therapist he is good and real good at preserving the existing relationships. I haven't lost a single one.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 8:03:31 GMT 8
I really don't know if this collateral damage thing is limited to just trans issues. I just think it's one of the consequences that we face as humans making decisions. One of the the consequences of self expression. Just remember that collateral damage can be just as much a consequence to you and your psyche too. Marriage vows and being true is an extremely nobel thing but if it becomes unbearable to a person and makes a person unhappy and depressed all the time, how can you make someone else happy? I gave a marriage up. I was extremely unhappy having to stifle my self expression and my unhappines affected her and made her miserable and unhappy. Yeah after a little greiving on both sides, she is happy with someone else and I am happy being me. My situation was a little different becuase there were no children involved. Just me and her. Children do make it a little more complicated and they are people too so they will have preconcieved notions and some will accept and others can't. Maybe in time they can. Usually shock is the first thing and someone they expect turns out to be totally different than their expectations is a shock. Trinity, I have said this before and that is this has always been with us and has shaped who we are. Or for me anyway. Oh yeah some may have embraced it, others may have denied it, but in my case it has always been there. That is what made me ex fall in love with me in the first place. She was attracted to that part of me because we could be lovers and friends. I liked shopping with her. We liked the same movies. But when the realization of just who she fell in love with was presented to her, she couldn't take it. But I just couldn't supress my true self anymore so I had to let go. She couldn't love the real me anymore after I reavealed to her just who I was so she had to let go. As for damage hon, just make sure you don't become damaged trying to prevent the collateral damage. If you can;t be happy then those around you won't be happy either. I don;t know how helpful this was but it was my situation and everyone's situations and circumstances are different. Agreed my dear. However our marriage is very fulfilling. The pain is largely the face mismatch with the girl. Take the mirror away, I look down, and trust me I am girl. I have not worn male underwear in years. Yeah it was from the beginning. And maybe that is why slow transition works. The core remains, sure it integrated, but components are always present. The core issue always seems to be fear. Faith should be antidotes, after all we had the visions. So I really should not be so weak. And as Patty says, how many trans get to run around the house in a thin open shirt and eye candy lingerie? Test that is my normal accepted embraced current presentation. I think I am the luckiest late transition mtf I know. Besides Patty who got it all.. yay girl, you are a beauty. So, the fear is not reality. It's just damage from decades of abuse. Points well taken. Will take them to heart, and to bed. Tonight is romance, intimacy and passion. I am one lucky little bitch. Blessings Trinity
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 18:25:06 GMT 8
Life is starting to border on the miraculous for me.
Intimacy is becoming frolic,,love and a new form of sex is in play...she won't touch my boobs but that's fine.
It really is about values, constancy, sacrifice, god, compassion,and finding workable boundaries, careful speech, reinforcing the whys.
Hiding the pain..they know anyway they are instinctive.
They had to sense we were different in the beginning, to Jamie's point.
I am living a life I never dreamed possible.
So, sex is restored now two years into full hormonal transition.
Shrink guidance and that of trustworthy friends, lots of communication. And for me constant reinforcement of physical cause. Des actually made it easier for me. Not sure how others have to approach it, but birth anomaly works for all of us. Or defect if you wish, I abhor that word for trans, I am not defective j am unique.
Thoughts and this morning celebration.
I look sexy in bed now. Woo hoo...!
:-)
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 1:00:09 GMT 8
I wanted to quote a few things Jamie said earlier as she tripped a few switches in my brain....
So many times we have seen marriages where the man becomes a passive/aggressive abuser and we scratch our heads in wonder as the woman continues to forgive the abuser right up until she is murdered. We wonder how that can possible be and what was wrong with that woman for tolerating that abuse in the first place? So let's examine one of the realities concerning cis women. One of the causes of "collateral damages" in a marriage no matter how well a couple meshed early on in terms of enjoying the same things and having a real buddy-pal type relationship, is based on how well centered the cis spouse is concerning her own self esteem. Many cis women get their sense of self validation and completion as women from the fact that they have their man and being married is just one of the biggest diamonds in their heart of hearts. They are proud of their"man" and cling on their arm when together in public and they get noticeably miffed when a younger prettier woman shows her man any undue attention. Most women get this and whenever I have any conversation with another woman alone in a public place they invariably say, "Tell Laura I said hi!" They are acknowledging the wife's place with the husband over that of their own, it's a cis woman thing and I get it.
If that man suddenly has a personal epiphany that becomes as all consuming as GID and the accompanying dysphoria then the very foundations of that man's woman is shaken to the very core. A married woman who is extremely self assured to begin with and whose self esteem and sense of validation is not hinged on the fact that she is married and has a real hunk for a husband can usually work through it with a considerable amount of lengthy and honest conversation and TLC and there will be some compromises and mutual meetings of the minds involved.
If that is not possible and the woman isn't strong then the former buddy-pal relationship will suddenly pale to insignificance and life together will become a living hell. No one should ever remain in an unhappy marriage for the sake of satiating the needs of another. It would be guilt based and a miserable place for anyone to live out their remaining years. And there can be no condemnation for anyone divorcing under those circumstances ever.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 1:51:18 GMT 8
Wow.
So this insight leaves me with questions.
Like, how important sex is vs public presentations.
It seems social fluidity is advantageous assuming it is core driven not a facade.
That consistency is key.
Personally the dynamics have not changed except in losing the deception, the secrecy, the hidden clothes, the hidden identity.
The other thing is kids.
It helps me two accept. Now.
It sets back every time the accepting one triggers.
There also is a mourning fore the loss of the old man that was always a rock for them. Stability is shot.
Yet we have families that survive transition.
What are your thoughts on the ones that make it? What do they have in common?
Agreed misery is not healthy nor sustainable.
But I think there are ways to preserve and give it a chance. And I think Nonbinary is an advantage.
The other issue is the kids. When one is nonaccepting,what can we do...i don't like being forced past my comfort zone, and there are some absolutes now. Nails, hair. Not negotiable, not going to feel that again, period.
So accommodations need to be made by everyone....the kid will move anyway, she is of age. But for little kids and for grandchildren it's gotta be odd.
I know people that go stealth to stay out of it, but that's not necessarily healthy or possible.
Tough stuff. Could have helped to be less stigmatized by the cis.
But even so, daddy becomes different, or daddy becomes mom, mom becomes dad. As a kid, it's big stuff.
Thread question is how to improve this tough scenario.
Any thoughts my dears?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 2:16:14 GMT 8
] Like, how important sex is vs public presentations. Agreed misery is not healthy nor sustainable. But I think there are ways to preserve and give it a chance. And I think Nonbinary is an advantage.Any thoughts my dears? Sex as an outward expression of love for one another is always wonderful. Older women become less interested as they no longer have the natural lubricants, the tissues become tender and penetrating sex though desirable can be uncomfortable unless they are on hormone replacement therapy and use lubricants, then they become revitalized and more interested. The genetic male tends to be lazy and less motivated to be innovatively romantic and then as BB King once sang "The thrill is gone!" For some trans folks here that ability and interest wanes and is no longer here, for those that care it will take work but is worth the effort. Public presentation as a couple means more to the cis female always, keeping in mind how important it is to be seen as a "normal" couple or as close to normal as possible, so yes non binary is a definite advantage over full binary transition which in most but not all cases won't bode well for a couple. Some trans women married to cis women seem to be able to pull it off well enough based more on the best buddy-pal type of relationship between two women. It takes that certain cis female who will be able to tolerate that well and learn to love it. I suspect the fear of being seen as a lesbian is one of the biggest problems that confront most married cis women.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 2:26:45 GMT 8
See my edit regarding kids in last post.
Shan you're helping folks here dear
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Post by EchelonHunt on Dec 20, 2014 11:31:43 GMT 8
It's a tough situation that's for sure.
Your children haven't personally experienced the experiences you have gone through that developed you into the person you are today. They will struggle to understand, they may never understand but if they can learn to accept it on their own terms, it will relieve the tension. They are scared of losing their father but over time, they will begin to realize the father never really went away, you are still the person you were before... just happier. It will take time... time and patience. They may come around, they may not. If family is a strong value they hold, they will most likely come around and the family bond will be closer than ever before.
My family were very against my transition when I first came out. Lots of arguments and tears happened for the first few years, it was awful. Now, seven years later, while they aren't supportive of my transition, my family have come to accept it, they were terrified I would regret my decision (I don't) and ultimately, they just want me to be happy... and I am happy. I have blossomed socially and emotionally since HRT began - physical is another matter, need exercise and surgery to correct it. My grandmother still refers me as my birth name, this is because she is getting very forgetful and her health is very frail so as a result, my mother doesn't want to burden her with adapting to my transgender identity as she may not have much longer to live in this world.
It will be tough but if your family holds strong values in having a close-knit family regardless of gender or physical appearances, that powerful love will conquer all.
*hugs*
Jacey
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 11:50:48 GMT 8
Alright everyone, be on your best behavior. Jacey's here. We all don't want to get banned. Sarcasm of course.
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