Almost a detransition

[Trinity]

I'm in the strange place where I am more relaxed with the deadname, living in the gender I am normally socially, and being who I am with the physically transitioned gender and comfortable with that and the HRT needs and body changes that went with it.

It almost feels like a detransition.

Maybe by being among the full TS girls a bit I am seeing the big differences.

Whatever.  Frankly I think I am lucky, this is the easiest way to be trans with the least repercussions.

It's not regret, and I could easily have gone all the way she as well, but its more like a wrong was righted and I just became who I actually am from birth.

Ativan I think you knew this from the beginning. 

[Leena]

Full social transition just isn't right for some people. I don't know yet if it is for me, though I don't know that I will frame it as detransition if it isn't. Longer term masculine flip, maybe.

We don't know what the future might bring. I don't why it is such a big deal to a small number of cis people that some people are trans. It is a small number, but they are a vocal group. What would it be like for you if acceptance was the norm, and transphobes were the ones that were shamed?

[Ativan Prescribed]

For me this is the norm and I do shame transphobes.
I very firmly believe that most people are not all that they claim to be as far as binary, the world doesn't work in suc absolutes as they seem to think it does.
That said, most people are living in some kind of gender closet they are afraid to step out of and those who are the most afraid are the ones who fear trans the most and so have to play the bigot role to compensate for fear and the closet door they hide behind.
Wouldn't it just be easier to embrace their diversity rather than try to deny it to others because they live in fear that others will not like their personal diversity?
This is why gender is a construct, it isn't real because people fear that if they stray ten steps away from the flock of sheeps they hang with that they will be called out like the assholes call out people they don't even know and who don't know them.
Respect for peoples diversity should be easy to do, yet there are just enough cis binary who instead of taking the time to just understand they instead pretend that different is an abomination, while being carbon copies isn't.
There is no personal growth or growth of society when you shut down your brain and refuse to see the world as it is and demand that it never changes, that stepping forward is to be denounced as something that is going to destroy their meager lives.
If it wasn't for peoples personal growth and that is what fuels the growth of society, we might as well be living in caves and forget cave painting, thats just too fucking radical and will end in the bringing the end times, but then we wouldn't even know what that means now, would we...

[Trinity]

Dec 24, 2020 4:29:18 GMT 8 Leena said:

Full social transition just isn't right for some people. I don't know yet if it is for me, though I don't know that I will frame it as detransition if it isn't. Longer term masculine flip, maybe.

We don't know what the future might bring. I don't why it is such a big deal to a small number of cis people that some people are trans. It is a small number, but they are a vocal group. What would it be like for you if acceptance was the norm, and transphobes were the ones that were shamed?

   Interesting question.

I'd be living pretty much exactly the way I am right now.

[Leena]

I'm not sure I totally buy that, but the world as it is now tries to push us into the binary. I hope this is changing, but right now most people aren't going to perceive anyone as nonbinary. People just perceive me as one binary gender or the other. Various things I have done altered this somewhat, but some people are still going to perceive me as a guy and it is easier to just go with it if they do.

[Trinity]

Dec 25, 2020 2:30:06 GMT 8 Leena said:

I'm not sure I totally buy that, but the world as it is now tries to push us into the binary. I hope this is changing, but right now most people aren't going to perceive anyone as nonbinary. People just perceive me as one binary gender or the other. Various things I have done altered this somewhat, but some people are still going to perceive me as a guy and it is easier to just go with it if they do.

I would be more free, tis true.  But I did find a comfort zone living in the Matrix and typically use it.

I think thats more the key for me.

[Ativan Prescribed]

People will always have perceptions of people they don't know as being something that they probably aren't, gender is just one of those.

[Trinity]

Feeling very nb tonight, typical binary body perception and dysphoria stuff, but not typical beyond that.

So not that traditional narrative, and soooo not ever going back to what it was before I started HRT and became freed.

I can't really explain it.

And the E is hitting and making me feel better and a little high. It always does.

I made a decision to pull away a little from the TS group I am in (Not a forum). Love them dearly, and would like to keep on with it, seriously, but time has become more precious with my wife now with the health scares, and priorities are changing.

I've done this warrior thing for a while now, I think I need to kick back a little and let others take some of it as well. I'd do it in a heartbeat, but something is different, I feel more like I am called out to walk a different path, and I know I am not on the same one as most of those I know and love.

So, have to let it unfold as it will. Kind of sad, but family, which I am lucky enough or blessed enough to still have, ya know?

[Becky]

I have so much trouble putting my identity into words anymore.

I don't feel like transition is the path for me. My body doesn't give me sadness, except for the body hair that I can remove whenever I want. I can use padding for the top dysphoria.

I want to exist between genders (or outside genders, if folks prefer that image), and be accepted for who I am. From my perspective, my feminine side gives me energy, joy and love. My masculine side gives me strength and decisiveness. I need both sides in this crazy world.

Acceptance will only come if the whole concept of gender gets deconstructed. I feel like that is my path. I see myself as one of those folks with the sledgehammers on top of the Berlin Wall. I want to help smash gender roles to bits.

Newer generations are more and more accepting, and I feel like real change can happen.

[Leena]

Dec 28, 2020 22:15:49 GMT 8 Becky said:

I have so much trouble putting my identity into words anymore.

I don't feel like transition is the path for me. My body doesn't give me sadness, except for the body hair that I can remove whenever I want. I can use padding for the top dysphoria.

I want to exist between genders (or outside genders, if folks prefer that image), and be accepted for who I am. From my perspective, my feminine side gives me energy, joy and love. My masculine side gives me strength and decisiveness. I need both sides in this crazy world.

Acceptance will only come if the whole concept of gender gets deconstructed. I feel like that is my path. I see myself as one of those folks with the sledgehammers on top of the Berlin Wall. I want to help smash gender roles to bits.

Newer generations are more and more accepting, and I feel like real change can happen.

I'm not sure that's the only way. I'm not sure forcing everyone to be nonbinary, which the idea of smashing the binary can sound like, is any better than forcing people into the binary. Realize the binary works for some cis people and trans people that want to get close to them and are able to. It is a problem for trans and nonbinary people that are not able to, or don't want to. It is also a problem for cis people that are somewhat GNC.

Maybe acceptance can come simply from not hating those that are different from you. It's not that hard, but some people hate everyone that's different without even thinking much about it. Not everyone is the same, and not everyone wants the same things. 

I was very dysphoric about my body, and HRT and permanent facial and body hair removal helped quite a bit. I'm not sure I need or even want a full social transition. I've been genderfluid my whole life, and still am. I don't know I'd like things without a binary to go back and forth between.

[Ativan Prescribed]

If binary isn't a thing, then it follows that NB isn't a thing, and the idea of gender just pretty much fades into individualism, no rules, just people living their lives.
Binary is a forced concept and the escape from that is NB, NB isn't a forced concept and doesn't take anything away from people who wish to play the binary game, or construct as it is.

Take away the 'rules' of binary does nothing to change NB and it doesn't force NB to the front, it's the other way around, take out the 'rules' and NB becomes a lesser thing because there is no forced 'rules' to fight against.
NB exists solely because of the binary construct. It is the anti-construct, so by tearing down the construct to a level of non importance, NB becomes just a thing or not a thing, but binary rules being torn down opens up the rights of everyone to live as they are and without fear.
Things like women's rights are a thing because the 'rules' of binary dictate that they get less of them, and have to look and act in accordance with what men decide, and who made them superior? They did by enforcing their rules of binary gender.
Things like saying this is masculine or feminine is just a way of enforcing the 'rules', when in fact, everyone has all of the traits of everyone else, but they can't decide which ones to make the most of because of the 'rules'.
The entire thing of gender is what holds back most people from actually becoming the most they can be, to subscribe to the binary is dampening the spirit of people, because they feel like they have to paly the parts that the 'rules' dictate.
If left to be people and not reduced to male or female, gender becomes the biggest obstacle in people's lives, they are told they can't be this or that because of these 'rules' of the construct, the more you look at it as an overall and not just from a NB perspective, the more of a farce it becomes.
The fall back argument that society will suffer if the construct is dissolved in importance is ridiculous, people everywhere suffer plenty because of the enforcement of the construct 'rules'.

[Leena]

You can just not follow the rules if you don't like them. There are sometimes consequences, but like other rules, they aren't often enforced. They are enforced by ourselves more often.

I don't see what you are suggesting actually happening, at least not in my lifetime. I could be wrong though, I didn't think the level of current level of acceptance possible a few decades ago.

[Ativan Prescribed]

This kinda goes into what I was saying before about ourselves and where we will end up at.
It's common for people to think of themselves as finished products because it is too hard to imagine our future.
While we realize that things will change and we will as well, the difficulty in seeing a much changed self as well as like society in the future is because we can't imagine most changes that will happen.
We can predict things of course, and we set goals like always, but when pressed for what we expect, we fall back on that finished or nearly finished product of ourselves as well as society.
But when we talk about how we got to this point, we can talk about how things have changed in terms that is more change related than what we can talk about of ourselves and society, we can readily see lots of changes, this is hindsight.
But to even pretend that we know the future is just beyond us, we simply don't know in what directions actual changes will go, could be positive, might not be.
What happens for a lot of things is relatively small changes over the first time frame that the change starts in, but in the next timeframe that is the same amount of time, we might easily see more of an amount of change.
This goes on until it reaches an exponential amount of change in that same amount of time, the changes go farther and faster, because when we can see things are changing and if there is something someone can do about it, they do, they push the change.
Not everything is going to go this way, but when you look back at things, you can see some things do go through this process, and still other things hit the wall because the change is too fast and someone gets in the way of change.
But societies rules, the unwritten rules, the rules not spoken about, there are lots and lots of big changes that happen over smaller time frames or bigger changes over the same amount of time, exponential change.
Communication is a big part of how this happens, a good idea can catch on and go global in a very short amount of time, but parts of the changes that happen can do this and when there is enough accumulation of parts, we realize a big change.
Technology is a huge example of how we change, look at how we use it and how we used it ten years ago and then ten years before that, you can see how the changes become bigger and faster in technology as a whole.
I doubt anyone can keep up with the things that are going on right now, a single person can't keep track of them even with communications as they are, so thats one thing that is likely to see a big jump sooner than later.
But the way people see other people is changing rapidly, like when I was a kid aq southern accent was thick, but as TV became more mainstream and then MTV, the younger generations started to lose that thickness in the accent, and today its harder to place people by the way they talk.
People are much more mobile and with communications and mobility, regional accents are going away to the point that you really have to listen for them and the younger the person, the harder it is to place them regionally.
Fashion is like this as well, what used to be regional isn't very much at all, and even around the world fashion is becoming less localized all the time.
So things like gender rules can and are being bent and broken more and more, but I think its about due for an exponential leap of sorts, this last year has made a lot of people take a better look at themselves and those around them, what was commonplace still is, but uncommon is moving faster all the time, and when things change at a faster rate, the exponential leap is a good possibility, while gender will be here for who knows, the rules for gender are likely to have a radical change coming in the near future.
And even in technology, the old standard rule of thumb was that to be at the front of it meant being about ten years ahead in whatever it is you are working on, now you hear and read about new stuff discovered or developed and they commonly talk about a year to just a few years before it's everywhere.
Things are changing at a faster rate and its because we are more and more accepting of big changes, we demand them in things like the phones we use, and there is a strong sense of nostalgia for other things as a balance.
But nostalgic for the good old days of say like the fifties when it comes to equal rights and such just isn't happening, look at how hard and fast BLM took hold in the last year, we are not going to go backwards into the past when it comes to society, we are in effect on the brink of that exponential leap of society moving forward into a better place for people to live, what is holding us back is that life moves at a slower pace than technology, but technology is posed to make leap after leap in the near future, society and the way we live has to take a leap of faith that we can as people.

[Becky]

Dec 29, 2020 7:19:16 GMT 8 Leena said:

Dec 28, 2020 22:15:49 GMT 8 Becky said:

I have so much trouble putting my identity into words anymore.

I don't feel like transition is the path for me. My body doesn't give me sadness, except for the body hair that I can remove whenever I want. I can use padding for the top dysphoria.

I want to exist between genders (or outside genders, if folks prefer that image), and be accepted for who I am. From my perspective, my feminine side gives me energy, joy and love. My masculine side gives me strength and decisiveness. I need both sides in this crazy world.

Acceptance will only come if the whole concept of gender gets deconstructed. I feel like that is my path. I see myself as one of those folks with the sledgehammers on top of the Berlin Wall. I want to help smash gender roles to bits.

Newer generations are more and more accepting, and I feel like real change can happen.

I'm not sure that's the only way. I'm not sure forcing everyone to be nonbinary, which the idea of smashing the binary can sound like, is any better than forcing people into the binary. Realize the binary works for some cis people and trans people that want to get close to them and are able to. It is a problem for trans and nonbinary people that are not able to, or don't want to. It is also a problem for cis people that are somewhat GNC.

Maybe acceptance can come simply from not hating those that are different from you. It's not that hard, but some people hate everyone that's different without even thinking much about it. Not everyone is the same, and not everyone wants the same things. 

I was very dysphoric about my body, and HRT and permanent facial and body hair removal helped quite a bit. I'm not sure I need or even want a full social transition. I've been genderfluid my whole life, and still am. I don't know I'd like things without a binary to go back and forth between.

Mutual respect and love should be universal.  It's a shame that so many folks don't get this.

But I'm absolutely on board, and I try to emphasize it while I teach and mentor my students.  It's a start.