U.S. Voters Say 68 - 27% Let Transgender People Serve

[Ativan Prescribed]

U.S. Voters Say 68 - 27% Let Transgender People Serve  

There is also some pretty good indications of what people think about congress, etc...

[Leena]

I don't think this is quite the wedge issue some Republicans thought it would be. While there clearly are some people that hate us, maybe it's not quite as many as we tend to think...

[Deleted]

Yeah well, they didn't serve. I did and I am trans and I am saying it is not the right time right now. Later in peacetime but not now and I am a transwoman that served. I would serve again if I was young enough.

Honestly and the total truth. I am a trans woman. I served. I still did my own shit off post though. In all honesty I do not want my trans sisters subjected to what the enemy may do now. It would be good if everyone followed the Geneva Convention rules but they don't. As a trans woman then and now, I would not want to serve openly.

So the 68 percent want to feel good and not want to feel judgmental and the 27 percent are realists. Only one percent roughly actually serve in the armed forces. So where is do they lie in their opinions? I can tell you now that when I served I could have given a fuck less. So 68 and 27 is only 95 percent. what about the other 5 percent? They are probably the ones that have served and could care less. I was a sissy but shot really good when shit went down hill fast. They knew. There were gays and trans in my unit and that wasn't what was important. Lives were though. Big deal, I was sissy. Big deal my team mate was a fairy. big deal because when shit is bad politics ain't worth a shit. Ask some Navy SEALs about that.

[Ativan Prescribed]

An article I saw about service members opinions had an even higher percentage who say they should be able to serve, regardless in what capacity.
It isn't 68% who want to feel good, it is 68% who feel they should, as opposed to the 27% of assholes who are prejudiced and don't even want them to use their southern baptist republican bathrooms, republicans on the wrong side of the fence, deplorables who will kiss trumps ass the second he drops his pants.
It's what people decided they want or not want, and some who can't decide, it matters not that you would serve again right now despite that you say trans shouldn't serve right now, and Navy Seals don't spout off about much of anything if they don't want some republican backlash about how they should have the same opinions as they do, despite that most of them were never in the military, which if they had, then a higher percentage of them would agree they should be able to serve, instead of being the complete jerks and out of touch politicians they are, even less of the population thinks they are doing a good job in Washington, so having a military background that is decades old is not a qualification to hack at the opinions of 68% of the country just because you don't like the odds.
But be happy that 27% of the people agree with you, regardless of your self described qualifications.

[Deleted]

No Ativan, Navy SEaLs don't spout out about anything let alone about what political party is in charge. They don't say shit because of the mission they signed up for and since they used to work under the radar the military lost a little bit more to keep someone alive or take them out of harm's way.

You want to see how elite military members think about it? What ever happened to SEAL Team six after they were used as a political prop? I know. One has written a book that claims to have killed Osama. That whole team and the SEALS as a whole had bigger targets on their backs that what was there before. What should have happened was the downed chopper should have went down as a conspiracy theory and Osama should have just faded away and never heard from again. The military have the same amount of LGBTs percentage wise as the percentage within normal everyday society.

So seriously before you start trying to invalidate me maybe look in the mirror because you are doing the same thing that you say republicans do. And by the way, we do serve, we have served and we will continue to serve. To some like myself it was proof to myself, to others it is a sacrifice as well it should be, to others still it is a job to work toward a goal and learning a skill.

You may not like me now and I really don't care if you do or not. But I do have my own opinions and if people hate me for them so be it. You can try to invalidate my "trans status" all you want. I don't need your approval for that or any political party's empty promises or even society's approval and validation. But from experience I do know what it takes for change in the military and right now during wars that we are fighting and possible wars on the horizon, now is not the time to force change. We do serve and with honor. We knew before we signed up what was accepted and not accepted and we still chose. I spent a few years of my life hiding it while on duty and sneaking around to express myself. But my service was not just about me, it was about me and the others that I served with. For their lives, I think that I can go along for a little while because it was never just about me only.

Politically dear, I am libertarian. I could give a crap less about Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton. I do give a shit about gays and trans being hanged in strict Islamic states though. I do give a shit about women treated as second class citizens and I sure as hell don't want to see that happen here in the United States or any other Western nation. I was stationed in South Korea and knew how they perceived trans women. North Korea not so much the same. Does anyone know how trans women are treated in North Korea? They aren't because they are executed. Same with people that have mental retardation, genetic deficiencies such as autism and so on and pretty much anything else that may hamper the supreme leader's agenda for utopia in his mind.

So invalidate me all you want because I don't support something that a political party tells me I should support. I am all for openly trans in the military when the military can take tactical resources away to accommodate and plan.

Society is changing and this poll just reinforces that. We have sympathy as a society toward who we are and it is about time. But military service should be about sacrifice and the biggest sacrifice a person can make is to think of others lives instead of just their own. I was deployed to Somalia twice and the first time I volunteered the second time I was asked because too many people that signed up for the college did not want to go and possibly die. So they were self inflicting wounds to stay out of deployment to a really bad "zone". Oh I would have loved with the "dog turd" on the back of my head due to long hair. I would have loved to stand in formation with subdued nail polish and light makeup. I would have loved to wear my earrings and pumps while in Class As for payday activities, and eventually all of us will when the bad shit settles down. And again now is not the time and this is for all of us not just military personnel but for everyone to enjoy the freedoms to express ourselves.

If I get banned then so be it. Ban me if you need too, Jayce but the world doesn't revolve around us. It doesn't revolve around anyone in particular. Instead of expecting a political party to force your acceptance in society why not let them accept you on what the think is thier own terms? Forcing them to accept you will do nothing but cause resentment. When it comes to laws? I have a CCW and if my life and body is in danger then I can defend it. Anyone can as long as you can pass the class. My CCW only cost me nothing. The class was free and the state's fees were waived because I have served and provided my DD form214. So maybe the second amendment isn't such a bad thing because it has saved me a couple of times. Hillary is not so much about the Second Amendment.

But Ativan, what about the people that want to kiss Hillary's ass? Aks Bill about that one. Do you know what the percentage of the people that serve in milatry service? Roughly one and a half percent. Ask them. Roughly 90 percent would say they don't give a damn as long as they can depend on their team mate to cover their asses in order to get home to their loved ones. It really isn't a military issue, all the BS is caused by political issues and politicians that want votes by empty promises. Just remember who was against gay marriage before they were against it. Do you really think any political party has your best interest at heart or even cares about Ativan or anyone else? No they just want your vote. And no I don't kiss Donald Trump's ass. And no I am not the 27 percent either and I use whatever fucking bathroom that matches my presentation and never had a problem but I talk and act like a woman. I don't even do the man thing anymore but even whne I did, I would never claim to be female wanting to use the men's room because that should be a right.

To be completely honest and somewhat intellegent, why are we letting freaking politicians define us with empty promises for shit that they have no control over? Why do we see politicians as saviors that will swoop down and make laws that protect us with a dire othreat of hurting or killing on of us when we can protect ourselves? Why should we expect them to make our lives better? I have done pretty good in my life and the way people percieve me. I have never demanded respect from anyone but have respect from almost everyone that I know and deal with because of my personality. I don't need or want acceptance in which I will never get from anyone by forcing them to. Yet most people I deal with are respectful and accept me and call me ma'am. I am a trans woman and that is all. I am not a political activist or militant in my actions or hate others if they don't agree with me and my views.

So in short and to be honest you just tried invalidating me and it didn't hurt my feelings in the least. Maybe let's just respect one another instead of hating one another because of the presidential election of 2016. I would never invalidate you or even try but right on time you did me because I think different than you. I gave my opinion and why I think that way without ever questioning or denying your trans status but is that a status anyway? Why should we identify with what we are or how we voted instead of our status as human beings? There are people that hate me and there are others that tell me I am not who I am and with what you said, you are one of them. You tried to invalidate me and attacked me as being a trans woman but hon, just because people are trans does not mean we are not unique individuals that make up our own minds. It is the same with black people, if a black person is not democrat then they are invalidated by others as traitors to thier race. That is what is wrong in the world. Not being trans or being black or anything else. What is truly wrong in the world is expecting others to feel exactly they way you do. If not then they are traitors or somehow offend you.

I don't agree with you but I never ever tried to invalidate you. I disagree with you politically but instead of attack who you are, all I did was disagree with your views and so on. Sorry but you or the democrats or the repulicans or anyone else does not own me. So hould I be shamed to agree with you? Attacked for being a woman with a penis for not agreeing with you?

At the beginning of the reply I made a prediction and I was right. I was hoping that I was not going to be right but apperently I am not trans enough because of something so simple as voting. Now am I wrong? Do I need to be banned? I will leave that up to Jayce. If I am banned then so be it but I will speak my mind and whoever don't like it can kiss "it". But I will never bow down because I am a strong trans woman and will never play games to get along with others. It really sux that we have gotten to this point that who we vote for decides who we really are. All I did was give my opinion and you tried to invalidate me. What if I was trggered so easily that my suicidal blood would have be on your hands? I have an opinion so let's talk about it intellingently and respect one another instead of trying to to invalidate someone. I don't need anyone's validation let alone yours or anyone else's.

I left this sight thinking that maybe people have calmed down and realized the sky is still blue instead of exploding and we all die. None of my rights have ever been violated that is set forth within the constitution. I still use the ladies' room to pee. I still make wine. I still have my "Little John" in my purse to save me if need be because that too is a right for me. I still run my business and I still wake up everymorning having to shave my legs, and everywhere else too and still know who I am. but maybe jsut maybe think about your actions. What if a tans voted for Trump is reading your posts that are triggered easily? If you invalidate me what about someone that is on the edge? Words and posts have consequences and you may never know but would you care? What you don't know may not hurt you but what if I was easily triggered to suicide and bit a 9mm round last night? being an activist is one thing but all the trans people that voted and think differently than you may think different. Maybe even react differnt than I do with your invalidation to me. Personally I don't give a fuck how you voted or what you think, but others may. And if you are going to invalitdate me, then what about others like me? We don't matter to you? You still matter to me and I would still die trying to save you or protect you even if you hate me now.

[Jennifer (Tink)]

Sept 17, 2017 0:16:16 GMT 8 @jamie said:

None of my rights have ever been violated that is set forth within the constitution. 

Jamie, although I am happy your constitutional rights have not been violated, as you said before, the world doesn't revolve around just you.

Myself and countless others that have no voice have been violated at a time. Please don't see things from just your world perspective. I have been trying but it's been difficult.

Politicians do define what happens to the public. If we don't like it then we speak up and vote their ass out of office. Just like any other group that needs support, the trans community needs a voice in government as well.

And that is what I think most people keep forgetting.

:hugs:

-- Jenn

[Deleted]

Look. Everyone I apologize for all this and what I said. I still stand beside serving openly though because I don't want anyone to die in a battle zone.

I was out of line. I served when I was trans and thought I would maybe go downtown and buy enough pills to take my life but I found a way. Both overseas for a short time and stateside too. Yeah it gets that serious or for me it did anyway.

But sweety if you are expecting some politician to come and any swoop you away or change your life, just give it up. They will not ever change your life good or bad. They will promise you the moon and send you to hell. You my dear are the only one that is able to change your own life.

Take charge of your life and change it how you want it to change. To be quite honest you are expecting a hero when all you are going to vote for is a zero that is a power whore. This goes for all of us. I would love is someone swooped down from voting heaven and saved me and made me so a woman. Yeah well that don't work. I have prayed for it since I was 13. It will never happen. No matter who you vote for or what you believe of how hard you beg. You "Bae" have to make your own life. You have to let those around you know who you are whether they hate or accept you. It is not up to any politician, it is all up to you to change your little piece of the world and that may change someone else's own little piece of the world and make it easier for them. People want a savior. Life don't work that way. We have to save ourselves. We have to change our own little world and make it a better place. Some people will think a politician will make it better but no. Some think a savior will make it better but no too. We have to change our own little world. We have to change i8deals about us. We have to let people see that we are just people too. It is up to no one but ourselves. So we all have a part to play and that is being open and honest to not only ourselves but others.

You know. I have done my own little part in my own little community. Honestly, that is all I can do. I can do no more. I get called Ma'am and so on. it is up to each and everyone else to do their parts in their own communities. Honestly I am not the only one but I have busted my ass.

Please stop everyone for thinking someone will save you. Because it will never happen. Put your own life and whatever else in your own hands. There is only one person you can always depend on and that is yourself. Sometimes that is all you can depend on.

So change your own little world and let people get to know you as a person and not as an object. Being trans is belonging to a community but being a person is an individual thing. That is how we are going to change the world's ideals of us. If you are waiting for politicians to change it for you then... Well that is a waste of time.

 Personally I want people to know me as Jamie the trans woman and not that trans woman named Jamie.

 

[Jennifer (Tink)]

Sept 19, 2017 2:35:21 GMT 8 @jamie said:

Look. Everyone I apologize for all this and what I said. I still stand beside serving openly though because I don't want anyone to die in a battle zone.

I was out of line. I served when I was trans and thought I would maybe go downtown and buy enough pills to take my life but I found a way. Both overseas for a short time and stateside too. Yeah it gets that serious or for me it did anyway.

But sweety if you are expecting some politician to come and any swoop you away or change your life, just give it up. They will not ever change your life good or bad. They will promise you the moon and send you to hell. You my dear are the only one that is able to change your own life.

Take charge of your life and change it how you want it to change. To be quite honest you are expecting a hero when all you are going to vote for is a zero that is a power whore. This goes for all of us. I would love is someone swooped down from voting heaven and saved me and made me so a woman. Yeah well that don't work. I have prayed for it since I was 13. It will never happen. No matter who you vote for or what you believe of how hard you beg. You "Bae" have to make your own life. You have to let those around you know who you are whether they hate or accept you. It is not up to any politician, it is all up to you to change your little piece of the world and that may change someone else's own little piece of the world and make it easier for them. People want a savior. Life don't work that way. We have to save ourselves. We have to change our own little world and make it a better place. Some people will think a politician will make it better but no. Some think a savior will make it better but no too. We have to change our own little world. We have to change i8deals about us. We have to let people see that we are just people too. It is up to no one but ourselves. So we all have a part to play and that is being open and honest to not only ourselves but others.

You know. I have done my own little part in my own little community. Honestly, that is all I can do. I can do no more. I get called Ma'am and so on. it is up to each and everyone else to do their parts in their own communities. Honestly I am not the only one but I have busted my ass.

Please stop everyone for thinking someone will save you. Because it will never happen. Put your own life and whatever else in your own hands. There is only one person you can always depend on and that is yourself. Sometimes that is all you can depend on.

So change your own little world and let people get to know you as a person and not as an object. Being trans is belonging to a community but being a person is an individual thing. That is how we are going to change the world's ideals of us. If you are waiting for politicians to change it for you then... Well that is a waste of time.

 Personally I want people to know me as Jamie the trans woman and not that trans woman named Jamie.

 

Jamie, I agree with you. It's starts with those around you. But why stop there?

There has been a significant shift in acceptance for trans people. Why not help continue it by working at the governmental level?

To affect change at that level will make the basics a given going forward. I would love to see that

[Deleted]

Because Jenn the government is not there to swoop down and make change. That starts with us and not just tans issues either but all issues. People are going to change when they know others and genuinely like them. I have been saying this for a long time. Society changes. What was condemned yesterday will be accepted tomorrow. The more people get to know us on a personal level such and your neighbors and community and someone that is not to be feared then society changes it's perceptions.

To me the US government should be limited to what is set forth within the confines of the constitution. There are quite a few of us in government on local levels, state levels and national levels, but votes mean more.

This is the whole point I was trying to make and have been trying to make for a long time now. When laws are passed forcing society to accept something or a group then it causes more resentment than anything. Prohibition was a really good example of that. It caused more damage and violence and had the totally opposite effect until it was repealed.

Society is changing. Government should not force society to accept us. Yes I know sometimes it seems so unfair and too slow but we have to allow our own little "worlds" to accept us on their own terms. I live in the country and you would think that is the worst place for a trans woman to live, right? Not really. My neighbors respect me, I am called the preferred pronoun of my choice, I help them and they help me, we hunt together, we shoot together and even though they may not understand totally, I still get invited over to their homes. They don't hide their children from me and they tell their children to call me Miss Jamie. And if a question arises then I explain it the best way I can. I don't feel insulted in the least if they use derogatory terms. One of my neighbors absolutely loves Bailey Jay and he uses the term "shemale" which doesn't bother me. I have told him however that a lot of trans women do not like that term and he listened. He dated one of my friends a while ago and was a total gentleman. but she is kind of like me and don't care but he was still a total gentleman while they dated.

My whole point and I am so sorry for coming across so rash, but we don't need government to validate us. It is totally up to us and how we act and react in society. We don't need laws, we just need to be ourselves but that takes a lot. I know. Sometimes it may not be the most comfortable situation sometimes. But it will get more comfortable as time goes by. It is sort of like buying women's clothes for the first time or going to the makeup counter, it is scary as hell and you may make up an excuse but the next time it will be a lot easier and then eventually it will become natural and normal.

But in short, it is not up to a government or controlling entity, you have to change it. I know because it would be nice if God came down on a cloud with lightning telling people that trans people shall be accepted but that isn't the way it works. It doesn't work that way in governments either. We have to do our part to change how society views us. It does take a lot of work and being open about it and understanding of those that may not understand is a start. And no, as diverse as cities are or supposedly are, I would be so apprehensive to be openly trans. In the country not so much though. So I am lucky in that aspect. There are no trans areas in my town but I am trans and people know me and I am accepted. If you come where I live you will be accepted to as one of my friends and if out for a drink probably hit on at the bar. Government didn't cause that, I did through personality and patience.

If I changed my own little world and you change yours and everyone else changed their own little part of it then the whole world will change and then government will change to reflect that. My best friend is living with me now and she is astounded of the changes within the smaller community as compared with New Orleans. No we don't have Sothern Decadence or Gay Pride parades but we are hit on by guys in the local bar and called Ma'am.

You are in charge of your own destiny. The Government is and should be irrelevant to your own happiness. If the government writes laws that force someone to like you, then they will probably end up hating you. IRL I don't know if I would want to be friends with you or not. I would like to think we could be but in reality that takes time to form a bond of friendship. I don't care wht your think about government and you should not care about what i think of government either. In all honesty it is so hard to judge someone in black words writtne on a white screen. So get out there hun and make friends in real life. I dsagree with my real life friends all the time yet we are still friends.

But try with everything you can to make your ittle world better and it has an effect on a bigger scale. It is called the butterfly effect, flap your wings. I have flapped mine and I have no idea what effect it had around the world, but my own little part of the world is better for me though. I don't want to sound selfish but that is what really matters to me. Hopefully it matters to others but I have no way of knowing though. But 68 percent pro and 27 percent com seems to be a change to me. Hell I would settle for 50/50. That would be way beter than when I was growing up.

[Jennifer (Tink)]

Jamie I agree whole heartedly with what you have said. But what about things like gay / trans marriage? Gay / Trans adoption? Workplace discrimination against gays and trans people. etc... Let's not even start and the whole bathroom bullshit.

That is what I am referring to when I say we need to change things at the government level. Like you said start local, county, state, federal. I think these kinds of things are a basic right that should be afforded to the LGBT+ community. Just like blacks had issues before the civil rights movement (although the situations don't exactly match up but I think they are close in concept).

So in essence I agree. I don't want to force people to "accept" us but at least give us the same rights that others enjoy.

:hugs:

-- Jenn

[Deleted]

Sept 20, 2017 5:09:14 GMT 8 Jennifer (Tink) said:

Jamie I agree whole heartedly with what you have said. But what about things like gay / trans marriage? Gay / Trans adoption? Workplace discrimination against gays and trans people. etc... Let's not even start and the whole bathroom bullshit.

That is what I am referring to when I say we need to change things at the government level. Like you said start local, county, state, federal. I think these kinds of things are a basic right that should be afforded to the LGBT+ community. Just like blacks had issues before the civil rights movement (although the situations don't exactly match up but I think they are close in concept).

So in essence I agree. I don't want to force people to "accept" us but at least give us the same rights that others enjoy.

:hugs:

-- Jenn

Yeah Jenn. That is exactly what we have the Supreme Court for. The bathroom debate has never been brought to the Supreme Court to decide. Oh as for Gay marriage the Supreme Court was 5 republican appointments and 4 democratic appointments at the time.

I use the appropriate restroom to how I am dressed and never had a problem I may not be the cute little "thang" but if I am dressed like a woman then it is really not appropriate from me to use the men's room. But then again you get into things like private property laws. Businesses are private property and hands off for the government. I do a lot of body work like shaving my legs everyday, and hell the face sux shaving everyday and dress just right and so on. As a trans woman I would not want a man in the stall standing to pee next to me. I would feel unsafe. As a male in men's rooms I have felt unsafe and have seen men peeking through the spaces of the stall. I was still shaving and smelled nice and was attacked.

We have those rights now. If you walk like a duck and talk like a duck then you pee like a duck and no one will say anything. I gave up the man thing a while ago but when I would dress like a man I would use the men's room. No big deal If I was dressing the part. Dressing as a woman then I use the women's room.

The bathroom deal would not be a deal if it was not front an center. Locker rooms and public showers, No thanks for me. I wil wait until I get home when I go to the gym. Do you know how bad it sux driving a truck and trying to shave your face in the sleeper and parts of your chest so you can get dressed normally and use the ladies restroom in a truck stop? It does big time.

Yeah you are right. It is likened to civil rights though. But it is still private property laws though. The government doesn't want to touch private property laws and not even the Supreme Court. So it is up to us to change the perceptions of the public. Personally I would feel safer with a 10 year old daughter peeing in a stall next to a trans woman that puts in all the work to be a woman than a 10 year old son peeing in a stall next to a priest. No offense to any one relgious but the statistics though. Private property owners can discriminate but government can not. So in a rest area that is on a federal Highway and maintained by the state, you can use whatever restroom you want. In a private business if the they clock you because you have a zz top beard in a sun dress they can.

So it gets a little more complicated than just rights. I have never had a problem and you probably wouldn't either dressed like a woman and sat to pee and pooping? LOL never in public.

I mean I may never be accepted but I cn always choose who to support with my hard earned money. When the government makes laws and force people to serve me then they may hate me for who I am. Do I really want to support their business and livlyhood? Hell no. I would rather know who don't like me and who is going to look extra close when I have to use the potty before I spend my money to make their living. Eventually people will either change or lose money by being closed minded.

In the case of Chic Filet, the owners do not support gay marriage. That is their right, I may not agree with it but they hire LGBTs and promote them up to management without discrimination. We don't always have to agree with one another. I think the world would be piss poor if everyone agreed with me.

And hon I am sorry about your professional cuddling post too. I don't get it because I hate being touched by strangers. Hell I hate when people get within three feet of me which is my personal space. I meant no harm though. In a relationshship with someone then they can touch me, cuddle and whatever else. I didn't mean to offend you in that one either.

[Jennifer (Tink)]

Sept 20, 2017 6:32:57 GMT 8 @jamie said:

Sept 20, 2017 5:09:14 GMT 8 Jennifer (Tink) said:

 I didn't mean to offend you in that one either.

I wasn't really offended as much as frustrated that I couldn't really get my point across

No harm no foul.

Like I said, we may not agree but intelligent conversation is worth tons to me

:hugs:

-- Jenn

[Deleted]

Sept 20, 2017 6:38:26 GMT 8 Jennifer (Tink) said:

Sept 20, 2017 6:32:57 GMT 8 @jamie said:

I wasn't really offended as much as frustrated that I couldn't really get my point across

No harm no foul.

Like I said, we may not agree but intelligent conversation is worth tons to me

:hugs:

-- Jenn

I know or thought so because frustration sux. You really did get your point across though. I just couldn't understand it and was really trying and wanting too.

Oh yeah. We never have to agree on anything and we can still be friends. That is the whole point. I would never want to choose a friend but how much they agree with me.

Yeah talking and understanding without hate means more to me than anything else.