Christianity thread. scripture problems for trans

[Deleted]

Need help.

Christian only on this please, to avoid triggering, toxicity, anger.



Revalation, the comment on effeminacy and denying heaven.

Messes me up.

Have heard it refers to being given over to sensuality.

But this verse often takes me out.

It doesn't make sense given who Jesus is...

Thoughts.

[Taka]

back in they day... an effeminate man was one who surrounded himself with women. sleeping around is the real problem that is being issued.

[Deleted]

It would probably help if you cite chapter and verse to be more specific! There are a lot of chapters and verses that indicate how fatal the sins of man mentioned in them are, those are there to get your attention and they are to indicate that God is holy and mankind is flawed and that no-one will be acceptable to God under any of those conditions any more than you or I would find beef stew acceptable with dog turds floating in it. The bottom line for the believer who has accepted Christ, who is God's answer to our problems, is that it's all forgiven and the only sin that is truly mortal for anyone is failure to acknowledge Christ as God's answer for your human shortcomings.

[Deleted]

I try to live inside out instead of outside in. My Mother and Father made my body which will only last between 0 years of age to maybe possibly a little over 100 years of age. then it goes back to being the matter of this world, in other words back to dust and dirt, calcium, sodium and all the other elements. My Soul or Spirit was created by God and that was made in God's own image. Just one little thing to think about and ponder over, If man was created in God's image and God was male then how can women be created in God's image too? Are we looking not nearly deep enough for the answer for whoever our Creator is then that is who we basically are but on lower levels.

OK so just my opinion and believe it or not I do believe on one main God and Christ's life and messages. So I personally don't believe God is either male or female, but both in perfect harmony. I think our Spirits were created just like that with male and female aspects and we feel more comfortable with one over the other and tend to display those aspects regardless of the body that nature produced. God created our Spirits, the natural world created our bodies, Spiritually I am way more comfortable and content displaying female aspects of my Spirit. Maybe the whole message is we should allow the female and male aspects to exist in harmony. That we are born in nature one way to shock our Spirits to face the not so comfortable aspects that still have. If this is the case, then I'm failing. Because I still tend to embrace the female aspects Sprititually. Of course even as a believer in Christ I do believe in reincarnation. this is one reason I can't be classified as a Christian because of my beliefs in reincarnation but I do follow Christ's teachings.

Yeah I know I may not be welcome for my answers since you called for Christians but I'm kind of Christian in being a believer in Gnosticism which was the earliest from of Christianity but long forgotten. But God created my Spirit and right now my Spirit just happens to be strongly female and since I try to live from what is inside and project that outward, then the feminine is actually who I am. I ain't lying to anyone. Nature messed up not God. I am exactly who God Created. If I tried living as a full blown male then I feel like I would be going against what God instilled in me.

It is a paradox Trinity. I would say follow your own heart. People interpret things differently. People living as fake or false against what God Created can very easily be turned around on those that have a feeling of being male or female and living according to what is on the outside affecting what is on the inside. But with a Loving God, if we fail all we have to do is ask for forgiveness. But living genuinely by what is deep inside you, how can that be a sin?

Plus you have to look at it this way too. During times of war when the men fought, a man that didn't feel female but faked being female because he was scared to go to war? You would actually have to have known the person personally that wrote anything to truly understand it, other than that it is just interpretation. Listen to what is inside you. Trying to listen to someone else and what they think or believe, even listening to me and what I wrote will take away your personal relationship with God. God created us for a reason whether you believe in reincarnation or singe life incarnations, do not let anyone take away your personal relationship with God. Don't even let ancient texts take away that relationship because time changes everything. Evolution is Devine and we Evolve physically, psychologically mentally and Spiritually.

I kind of hope this helps but you are God's Child, not a preist's, minister's or preacher's. We are all God's Children and trying to understand the Mind of God will drive you crazy, so just be who God Created you in a Spiritual sense. Let what is inside shine outward and forget letting outside influences mold what is inside. Does any of this make sense to anyone else but me?

[Deleted]

Shan I need my computer for it, and it's specific to king James, others translate differently.

You already answered it though.

Jamie I need to look at yours later.

One verse out of context. Wrong. And the enemy of our souls is good at that.

[Laura J]

I've found that Jesus used and gave great responsibilities to non gender or trans folk in the bible.
God made a reference to non gender believers and said, We will have a place in heaven higher than his sons and daughters.. (Paraphrasing).

The reference in old testimant to men wearing women's clothes & visa versa, and hair lengths, has been taken so out of context, like many others.. That passage was referring to being in military situations and others during that time, and was never meant as a broad teaching to society.

Every painting of Jesus I've ever seen had him adorned in long beautiful robes, with long flowing hair that any woman would be proud of today. Yet these religious extremists and blind followers scream at trans and anyone gender fluid as it being such a sin..?

I lay myself and my trans self at the foot of God each day, and each day I am filled with peace from his spirit, and blessed in my day to stand up and be proud of this special way I was created..!
And that is my yardstick of truth..

[Deleted]

John 3:16 "For G-d so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him shall not perish but have everlasting life."

It's a blanket statement meaning that G-d loves all of humanity, Jesus paid the required price for each person's shortcomings which required the issue of blood and the life of the sacrifice. This is a pivotal point in the history of mankind and the gift of forgiveness and eternal life available to every human being. The prerequisite for receiving this gift is believing in christ which entails more than simple head knowledge, but actually inviting Him into your life as Lord and Savior. Those who don't will be judged according to their works. Some people are very nice, good hearted and selfless human beings, but that isn't sufficient when G-d has offered His Son, anyone who turns away from that will be offering G-d all the goodness of their life mixed with their failures, which will be an offense to the face of G-d for refusing to acknowledge what He has done and as I had said before as an example, it would be like serving your own father a bowl of stew with dog turds floating in it. Of course it would be unacceptable, unpalatable and offensive for which you would deserve a beating.

This had been laid out as a prerequisite from the beginning of human history and is exemplified by the original Passover even before Moses got the law whereby the Hebrews sacrificed a lamb and smeared it's blood on the doorposts and lintels of their houses, that very night the angel of death took the firstborn in every household not so marked and the Hebrews were delivered from oppressive servitude to the ruler of their world, the Pharaoh. Jesus said, "Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if any one hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me." Rev 3:20 This is an invitation to ask the Lamb of G-d into your own heart.

Salvation is a positional thing, we still live in the world and we are still very human with all of our shortcomings, but we have a choice now of making a decision of which team we want to be on when it's finally game time, meanwhile G-d isn't going to throw anyone away for having bottom or top surgery or for any of the stuff we do, but refusal to acknowledge Him and the great sacrifice He offered in our behalf is an eternally terminal act.

"These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life." 1 John 5:13

[Deleted]

Feb 16, 2015 10:41:56 GMT 8 Laura J said:

I've found that Jesus used and gave great responsibilities to non gender or trans folk in the bible.
God made a reference to non gender believers and said, We will have a place in heaven higher than his sons and daughters.. (Paraphrasing).

The reference in old testimant to men wearing women's clothes & visa versa, and hair lengths, has been taken so out of context, like many others.. That passage was referring to being in military situations and others during that time, and was never meant as a broad teaching to society.

Every painting of Jesus I've ever seen had him adorned in long beautiful robes, with long flowing hair that any woman would be proud of today. Yet these religious extremists and blind followers scream at trans and anyone gender fluid as it being such a sin..?

I lay myself and my trans self at the foot of God each day, and each day I am filled with peace from his spirit, and blessed in my day to stand up and be proud of this special way I was created..!
And that is my yardstick of truth..

Yeah a man faking being a woman for trying to get out of war would have been a coward. Even some more modern men like on the Titanic that escaped with the women and children while women and children died and whatever the ship was that the captain was showing off and sunk it and then escaped and women and children died. Or like the ferry that sank recently and the captain escaped with some women and children drowning. Whatever happened to the Captain going down with the ship or at least being the last one off the ship? These are the people that are taking us from point A to point B on a dangerous ocean nowdays maybe because they have a college education?  I truly in my heart of hearts believe that it is talking more about cowardice than transness. OK so I am trans and I actually see myself as more female than male and I would give my life for a child. I would fight my hardest for a child, even as Female I would sacrifice myself for a child. Motherly instinct? Who knows but I would lose my life before I would let a child lose theirs or that child's mother lose hers. Even if it comes to war I would sacrifice my life to protect children. And even in a situation like the Titanic I would make sure that the women and children all were in the life boats before me even though I am female internally. But internally and externally sometimes sux. That is all I will say. But there are worst things in life than death. Living the rest of you life as a coward if you are a man or just living in general. Joan of Arc was a great hero and if Joan wasn't trans a great heroine.

[Taka]

those verses about wearing the garb of the opposite sex, probably has to do with war. women should not be forced to take up arms. men should definitely not pretend to be women to get away, leaving their families to perish. there are stories of men dressing like women to infiltrate the enemy, so just wearing the clothes is not a sin. the reason why, may be sinful though.

[Deleted]

Moreover it has to do with a pre-Christ admonition to people who were trying to live up to every jot and tittle of the Judaic law and when Christ did come He pointed out that under that law if your eye caused you to sin then to pluck it out and if your hand caused you to sin to cut it off because one would fare well in the next life without them because as the scripture says, the soul that sins shall die. He is pointing out the absurdity to an arrogant people of how abysmally impossible it is for them to keep the law perfectly. The entire old testament is telling us that the laws are perfect but that humans are flawed and imperfect and that anyone who keeps the whole law but fails in one part is guilty of all of it. This is why God offered His own Son to pay the price for all of us, what part of this do people not or refuse to get?

[Taka]

of course, for the love of god, we should all do our best not to sin.
even though it's impossible.
know nothing but love, if you can do that, you will never sin.
but what human can actually do that?

i'd worry about eating pork before worrying about what i wear.
i don't have to worry about that though, we've already been told that nothing on this earth is impure.
why didn't the jews eat prok? probably because their neighbors used it for religious rituals, offering it to a false god.

worry about clothing if you dress the way you do in order to commit a sin.
wearing clothes isn't a sin in itself.

[Deleted]

Well we sure have some deep thinkers on forum here. Yes, I remember now. The social context, meanings back.then vs now.

I get frustrated with some of Paul's stuff, I love johns, and the four gospels are hot.

I am about to go into a funeral, stealth male, or male fail. No bra so I am hug outed proof. Backwards culture, strong Pentecostals and a church I know has issues with the flesh and issues of other kinds.

It'll be a long night.

I so dislike legalism. Love the Lord thy God with all your heart, mind and soul, and love your neighbor as yourself.

Which means, embrace yourself like a child.

The others.

Because we are God s children, as we are.

And this other condemnation stuff. Does not compute, does not measure up to the totality of scripture.

I really believe in looking at the original language and culture to understand.

But thanks, once in a while the enemy says, did God really say...like in Eden, when the mess started.

He tried tempting God himself using scripture out of context.

As far as I am concerned, the ultimate culprit in using scripture to hurt us, is the enemy, working flesh and using tongues.

So many thanks. Oh I mourn his church, that falls into such error, losing the heart of Christ, failing his love so badly.

Blessings

Trinity

[Deleted]

Now the other thing that gets me is the gay thing. I am half transitioned, more than half. So gay, straight, les? Meaningless I am physically ...??????

Divorce would be vile...creating collateral damage unloving, unlesssthe cost to my mind outweighs it, which it does not.

We dealt with selfishness in the old threads on Susan's...decided it was dicey, I think.

Self will over God's will and opposing God's love seems to be the problem. I believe it is God's will that we were born trans. His love is we learn to embrace it and help.and love up others.

Clothes are meaningless. Dishonesty is from below, not above.

It all mixes in.

Jesus eunuch comments are a factor. Predestined given circumstances is another, a huge one too.

Trans because.... how does he want tho use that....

[Deleted]

Feb 17, 2015 22:07:40 GMT 8 Taka said:

of course, for the love of god, we should all do our best not to sin.
even though it's impossible.
know nothing but love, if you can do that, you will never sin.
but what human can actually do that?

i'd worry about eating pork before worrying about what i wear.
i don't have to worry about that though, we've already been told that nothing on this earth is impure.
why didn't the jews eat prok? probably because their neighbors used it for religious rituals, offering it to a false god.

worry about clothing if you dress the way you do in order to commit a sin.
wearing clothes isn't a sin in itself.

Right about that, believers make an effort to be right and not do evil as thanksgiving to God for what's been done by Christ in their behalf.

I think the Jewish dietary concerns about pork emanated from the possibility of getting Trichinosis from undercooked meat, so certain things were considered unclean, fish that have no scales like dogfish have underdeveloped urinary systems and pee through their skin and are considered unclean, though some places soak the flesh in vinegar before cooking it. So the dietary laws were geared for the survival of the Hebrews in the early times.

[Taka]

trichinosis really isn't as likely a reason as one may think. apparently, that wasn't much of a problem in their area back then.

you could compare it to horse meat. it was forbidden to eat it in norway for a long time. not because it was dangerous in any way, but because it was used in fertility rites. that doesn't go well with christianity.