What if mental "illness" is really mental liberation? (TW)

[EchelonHunt]

This is most likely going to be offensive and upset people, I apologize ahead of time but I want to try to explain my viewpoint the best I can without any misunderstanding getting in the way.

I am not suggesting mental illness does not exist, nor am I trying to invalidate people's experiences living with their disorders.

I am suggesting... what if... like how society reinforced the gender binary and made it the "be-all, end-all" of all things gender and sexuality-wise...

What if... mental illness is not really illness? What if society feels threatened by mentally ill people because they see the world in a different light, perhaps, a more realistic light, that dares to call out the lies and illusion society pulls over people's eyes everyday? What if mentally ill people are not the chaotic, dishevelled people society perceives them to be? What if mentally ill people are highly intelligent and their different viewpoint should be encouraged rather than shunned? Society deems those with mental illness as "abnormal, weird, freaks" (sounds similar to what transgender & non-binary folks are called, huh?), they try to feed people medicine to make them "sane", "stable", "normal"

^{(That being said, I do understand people need medicine to correct the chemical imbalance in their brain, I am mostly talking about the incorrect medicine that cause permanent harm than good.)}

Oh, there's that word again.

"Normal."

I have suffered depression since my pre-teen years. I dealt with suicidal thoughts that were relentless, planned my suicide and tried attempting it twice. I was also given Zoloft and it changed me entirely, I experienced violent visual and auditory hallucinations (people bursting into flames in front of me, voices talking and screaming), seizures and danced along the blurry line between what people call "sanity" and "insanity", I exhibited homicidal tendencies. I had a curiosity about morbid things ever since I was a child - horror is my fav genre, my curiosity became an obsession and I was given insatiable appetite to delve deeper into that side of me. Even after I was weaned off Zoloft, the seizures persisted but doctors were baffled as brain scans showed no abnormalities. The seizures have eventually dissipated but I still feel there is something "off", like I'm not 100% right and I probably never will be.

And you know what? I'm okay with that, I've accepted it.  

Depression and suicide have made me more aware than ever about society and myself. Generally speaking, people don't give a fuck about your problems, they are busy dealing with their own plate, be it real or imagined. The only person who can change and improve things is yourself alone. If I had not gone through depression or suicidal thoughts, I probably would not be so self-aware that I am today.

Mental illness can help a person as well as debatilibate them. I firmly believe it all relies on one's perception of their illness, if you believe your illness is a death sentence, a terminal illness, then it will be so.

Your illness is not a cage, it is liberation from the normalcy of boring people who are mindless sheep. Think of it as looking through a different set of lens, allowing you to view the world in a different perspective. It may be interesting or it may be downright horrifying. Depression took me down to the darkest corner of my mind, made me think of things I would have never dreamed of doing. It allowed me to succumb to a darker part of myself, to realise that if provoked, I can unleash hell if I wanted to.

The most powerful thing is the self-control. I choose not to unleash hell.

Not yet anyways...

[Ativan Prescribed]

Just what is considered normal and what rates as abnormal, depends on where society sets the bar.
Different societies set it differently for most things, and it is always changing.
It's an assumption that the bar is raised or lowered with new or more accurate information, but that's usually not the case.
Public opinion has as much to do with it as anything, and opinions generally have not much going for them in terms of accurate information in general.
It's estimated that somewhere around 1 in 10 in this country could be defined as having a mental illness at least once in their lives.
It's an estimate not because of inaccuracies in definitions, but more so because society resets the bar all the time.
And most people who could use help, are able to cover it up and do because of the stigma attached to it.
Normal isn't all it's cracked up to be, and from my perspective, the more normal you are or claim to be, the more boring a life you're living.
*(sarcasm ding noise) Boredom should be listed as a mental illness, boring people need to be taken in for an adjustment every now and then, a perspective tune-up of a sort.

It's also pretty sad that people will equate mental illness with a diminished intelligence as well.
Mention a mental disorder and peoples reactions to your ability to do something changes.
Even depression gives intelligence a bad rap, like you lost yours, because, well, depression, it does stuff, ya know?
Most highly intelligent people do qualify for one disorder or another, but are smart enough to either hide it or do something about it.
It's easy enough to just be quirky or eccentric, and if you demonstrate intelligence, that's what people will put it down as.

Some drugs they hand out like candy from pharmaceutical companies can and do cause more harm than good, but when they do work right, they are good.
It's just that prescribing them for things like depression is a crap shoot, they are guessing, and usually have a list of what to try first, and so on.
No matter what, they will give you Prozac, the very first time. It works as well as placebo's in recent testing.
But who gives a shit if it works, right? Side effects, that's why, go look them up, and be careful to step down the dose if you want to stop taking them.
If you don't, even if it doesn't do a damn thing, you'll spend a few days in mental hell, swearing you had a stroke or something, really, go look it up.
Look at what they prescribe for depression, almost all are SSRI's, all based on Prozac, they just attach another molecule or what ever that gets stripped off before it takes affect.
You end up with the same thing, some very slight differences that aren't worth trying one after another, yet they do, and they usually make you try them for at least a month.
There are enough to keep you in depression hell for years before they give up and try something that isn't an SSRI.
If one doesn't work, then the chances of another one working the way you hope they will is almost nil. Try something different, demand that you get something different.
Wellbutrin is one, there are others that I'm not familiar with, there are a few new ones on the market, but looking at them, most are another variation of the same SSRI.
I've been taking Wellbutrin for over ten years now, the dose has varied some, and without it, you don't want to be around me.
Nothing else comes close to working, but that's just me, it happens to work for me.
If antidepressants aren't working, talk therapy is usually going to, because it isn't a chemical imbalance that drugs are going to change, but a better perspective can do that.

But really, normal and sane and stable and all those other cookie cutter things that people strive for are not even an average, let alone something to strive for.
I have a distrust of people who appear to be normal, sane and stable people, they're hiding something.
Because those things are a myth, a set-up, a cop-out, an illusion, they are the worst excuse to use on another person to get them to conform to some standard that isn't real.
Nothing new and certainly nothing worth calling great has come from normal, let alone stable and sane.
If anything, where society sets the bar is from a disorder that causes people to strive to be the same as the other same people who are just the same as they are.

While most mental disorders are relatively easy to correct, the stigma to be seen as normal keeps most of them from simple and easy treatment.
And the ones who need it the most are often overlooked because they know just how easy it is to appear to be normal, when they really do need help.
It's all about where society sets the bar on these kinds of things, to much emphasis is placed on normal, an illusion.
Think I'm wrong? Look at all the controversy over changing the DSM to change transgender from a disorder to simply gender dysphoria, which not all transgender people even have.
Just know that there are still places on this planet that consider gay or lesbian to be a mental disorder still, and not only lock them up, but kill them as well.
Just like they used to do to people with severe depression, the graveyards around old sanitariums are filled with them.
They sanitized society by placing people in them.
Nope, normal is nothing to aspire to be, it's boring and shouldn't even be allowed.
We should be able to set the bar higher if it wasn't for all those people who claim to be normal and are the ones it seems, who set the bar in the first place.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2015 13:21:10 GMT 8 EchelonHunt said:

This is most likely going to be offensive and upset people, I apologize ahead of time but I want to try to explain my viewpoint the best I can without any misunderstanding getting in the way.

I am not suggesting mental illness does not exist, nor am I trying to invalidate people's experiences living with their disorders.

I am suggesting... what if... like how society reinforced the gender binary and made it the "be-all, end-all" of all things gender and sexuality-wise...

What if... mental illness is not really illness? What if society feels threatened by mentally ill people because they see the world in a different light, perhaps, a more realistic light, that dares to call out the lies and illusion society pulls over people's eyes everyday? What if mentally ill people are not the chaotic, dishevelled people society perceives them to be? What if mentally ill people are highly intelligent and their different viewpoint should be encouraged rather than shunned? Society deems those with mental illness as "abnormal, weird, freaks" (sounds similar to what transgender & non-binary folks are called, huh?), they try to feed people medicine to make them "sane", "stable", "normal"

^{(That being said, I do understand people need medicine to correct the chemical imbalance in their brain, I am mostly talking about the incorrect medicine that cause permanent harm than good.)}

Oh, there's that word again.

"Normal."

I have suffered depression since my pre-teen years. I dealt with suicidal thoughts that were relentless, planned my suicide and tried attempting it twice. I was also given Zoloft and it changed me entirely, I experienced violent visual and auditory hallucinations (people bursting into flames in front of me, voices talking and screaming), seizures and danced along the blurry line between what people call "sanity" and "insanity", I exhibited homicidal tendencies. I had a curiosity about morbid things ever since I was a child - horror is my fav genre, my curiosity became an obsession and I was given insatiable appetite to delve deeper into that side of me. Even after I was weaned off Zoloft, the seizures persisted but doctors were baffled as brain scans showed no abnormalities. The seizures have eventually dissipated but I still feel there is something "off", like I'm not 100% right and I probably never will be.

And you know what? I'm okay with that, I've accepted it.  

Depression and suicide have made me more aware than ever about society and myself. Generally speaking, people don't give a fuck about your problems, they are busy dealing with their own plate, be it real or imagined. The only person who can change and improve things is yourself alone. If I had not gone through depression or suicidal thoughts, I probably would not be so self-aware that I am today.

Mental illness can help a person as well as debatilibate them. I firmly believe it all relies on one's perception of their illness, if you believe your illness is a death sentence, a terminal illness, then it will be so.

Your illness is not a cage, it is liberation from the normalcy of boring people who are mindless sheep. Think of it as looking through a different set of lens, allowing you to view the world in a different perspective. It may be interesting or it may be downright horrifying. Depression took me down to the darkest corner of my mind, made me think of things I would have never dreamed of doing. It allowed me to succumb to a darker part of myself, to realise that if provoked, I can unleash hell if I wanted to.

The most powerful thing is the self-control. I choose not to unleash hell.

Not yet anyways...

Let me just say Jayce. If you ever commit suicide and succeed, I will kick you butt for eternity. LOL.

Zoloft huh? Sounds like a a trip for me.

But all kidding aside, it hurts me that you felt this way for so long. It kills me that you tried and thankfully failed twice at suicide. Mental illness. Yeah it is out there. The Columbine shooters. What's his name that shot up the theatre in Colorado. BTW I will not name names to give them any credit. Other's that have been seriel killers and so on. But you do make a good point. What constitutes mental illness? Some people need to be locked away or just have thier life ended just in case they escape because they are true monsters.

But mental illness and mental liberation? Hmm. Joan of Arc talked directly to God supposedly and was a hero to the Church until she was of no use anymore to them. And an Angel ( Gabriel maybe? I can't remember but that isn't important.) came to Mary and the Immaculate Conception resulted and gave us Jesus Christ. Jesus claiming to be the Messiah. Nichola Tesla and his Tesla Coil to provide free energy which would have killed the energy companies and it is proven that the Tesla Coil does work. Ugh. Lets see Newton, Galaleo, Christopher Columbus, Copernicus and many other were labled heretics or "nuts" in their time. So they wer crazy or mentally ill? Or were they just before their time? They all changed the way we percieve our world, solar systen galaxy and universe. Eventually they were proved right. Well except for columbus and he discovered Central America instead of India but he had the guts and craziness to sail the flat world and possibly sail off the end.

So no. I think a lot of time mental illness is misunderstood. I can tell people of multiverses existing simultaneously and people think I am crazy but the Theroretical Physist Michio Kaku says it and people belive it soemwhat because he has a pedigree and I am nothing more than a mut.

I don't have a ghost show on TV but have cassette tapes, if they even will play without turning to dust, with EVPs on it then I am a nut.

I think how mentally ill you are all depends on society's view on what is crazy or not.

I think Ativan is right. The whole world is freakin' crazy. And we may be the most sane of anyone. I truly believe we feel what humans are supposed to feel. We were created male and female so... Just sayin. Maybe it isn;t us that are mentally ill but psychologically whole and everyone else is so mired down on lower levels.

Look. I maybe crazy but in my heart and in my mind, I think we have a special gift. I believe we are humans that are the way humans were meant to be and eventually will be again. No we are not in anyway above anyone else. But we feel male and female or female and male and that in my opinion is divine. Remember though, persecution of what society is scared of is prevailent throughout history. We have to suffer in society because we are actually blessed. Not to mention as humans we are beautiful creatures. Both genders in one. How can that not be special? In the big picture sometimes true beauty is sometimes distorted by material thoughts or images.

Mentally ill am I? Who knows. I don't think so but you or anyone else can read this post and let me know. I don't care. I know I am crazy. But in a good way though.

[Taka]

higherperspectives.com/overthinking/

mental illness is what happens when a person loses the ability to be themselves, or becomes a danger to people near them for no reason that they themselves could call rational.

a whole lot of people diagnosed as mentally ill aren't. doctors will even call mourning depression if it continues for more than three days. and seriously, doesn't that sound a whole lot sicker than the person mourning a dead parent or spouse...?

normal reactions to stuff that happens in life, are not mental illness. but the person could end up developing a mental illness if people around them aren't willing to help the person get through it by accomodating a little when necessary. or if they're diagnosed with something they don't have and get meds they never needed.

[.......]

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[Trinity]

I am tempted to call you W. because I cant spell.

Brilliant post.

I personally am an alcoholic that came out of a condemned hotel building in a very dangerous Manhattan neighborhood and got sober 30 years ago. I also am diagnosed with anxiety issues. Dysphoria has driven me right to the edge of sanity many times, before I learned who I was, here on this forum.

Does this demean me in any way whatsoever? Or give me a springboard to reach out and help others?

Does you being you make you less than? No. It makes you you. And apparently you are already out of the matrix, already unplugged.

We are going to have a lot of fun, you will find brilliant minds in here, one of which is off forum for a bit of time.

What do they say, those who walk faster than the crowd fall out of step...walk another road....

Enjoy the reads, there are many in the past threads you are going to love.

Trinity

[Ayla]

K

Thank you for joining us and for your post. You echoed some of Jacey's thoughts and a little of Ativan's perspective, but your thoughts, analysis and insight have set off and triggered multiple streams of thought. I need to let it settle before I can tease the threads into some sort of order so that I can weave this into a more substantive thought.

The unexpected pebble has caused ripples and they expand. Nothing remains unaffected. Thank you and my best wishes for 2016.

Safe travels

Aisla

[Kira]

I was on Paroxetine. It was hell. It changed my life and I want my old brain back.

[Ayla]

K

Random thoughts only. Not even a sensible weaving. The more I reflect, the more it seems apparent that any deviation or mutation is resisted/excised by the group/community in what is a largely pointless and ongoing exercise in promoting standardisation and conformity. Whether it is sexuality, gender identity, mental illness (any deviation from the majority, societal norms or standards) in each area there will always be deviation or mutation. Nature promotes deviation, it is only by mutation that communities strengthen and new traits and qualities are introduced, encouraged and celebrated.

Unfortunately it isn't a whole lot of fun being a deviation or being seen to be anomalous. Life as an exception or as an outlier provides a fairly simple choice - wish that it was otherwise, deny your reality and pretend that you can be normal or else understand, accept and express your nature.

For some of us this relates to our sexuality, gender identity or mental state. For others it relates to other aspects such as their ableness, their color, their being born female in a male dominated society etc For a few, more than one exception from societal norms may exist.

In every case it seems to point to a choice - denial or acceptance (pretending 'normality' or owning your uniqueness). As more of us own our nature or our deviation, we become more visible, we become more familiar and acceptance grows. We become less of an exception and more comfortable, less stressed and less at risk.

My wish is that each of us moves forward in 2015, finding the respect, acceptance and celebration that we each deserve.

Safe travels

Asila

[Taka]

homosexuality has been a mental illness. transgenderism is still a mental illness in many countries.
modern society is crazy in its normativism, calling naturally occurring phenomena illnesses.

even schizophrenia is no longer a mental illness. it's a physiological phenomenon when the hearing center of the brain is hyperactive and produces actual voices. scientists have found a way to turn it off using a weak electric current. when it turns off, the person stops suffering because the voices are no longer there to make them feel like shit. not that mental health professionals will care, they'll still think of it as some kind of psychosis. but hopefully we'll get better treatments for it.

multiplicity is also something that may not be a mental disorder, when it's not a result of severe trauma.

[DriftingCrow]

With just skimming through most of the posts here. . .

I think it really depends on how you personally define "illness." Things like schizophrenia and other conditions that give hallucinations were not seen as an illness in some cultures (as others have said) but the person was seen as having access to the spiritual realm. Part of what we define mental illness as really depends on our own cultural context. Having hallucinations may have been a bit more liberating in a society that would've accepted you as a being with devine access to the spirit realm and treated you as some sort of spiritual guide.

Though, physical illness -- usually described as something that makes you feel unwell, makes you feel tired, produces physical pain, may shorten lifespans.

If we take the same concept over to the mental side of things, I'd say some "mental illnesses" are indeed not liberating. If something causes you to feel mentally unwell, mentally tired, gives you mental pain and anguish, etc. then I'd say that's probably an "illness."

[Deleted]

Jan 6, 2016 16:01:12 GMT 8 Taka said:

homosexuality has been a mental illness. transgenderism is still a mental illness in many countries.
modern society is crazy in its normativism, calling naturally occurring phenomena illnesses.

even schizophrenia is no longer a mental illness. it's a physiological phenomenon when the hearing center of the brain is hyperactive and produces actual voices. scientists have found a way to turn it off using a weak electric current. when it turns off, the person stops suffering because the voices are no longer there to make them feel like shit. not that mental health professionals will care, they'll still think of it as some kind of psychosis. but hopefully we'll get better treatments for it.

multiplicity is also something that may not be a mental disorder, when it's not a result of severe trauma.

Yeah and not too long ago the Psychiatrist that declared that it wasn't a mental illness died not too long ago. That whole first paragraph I totally agree with.

As for schizophrenia though, I have heard the same thing. But in a parapsychological sense it may be being ultra sensitive to high EMF fields. It can be caused by anything such as faulty wiring in a home, Cell phone towers, Faulty appliances and so on. Some symptoms of hypersensitivity to high EMF fields is feelings of paranoia, Hallucinations (visual and auditory).

When I talk about normal or hear or see the word it is all relative to me. What is normal? The person that is obsessed with their job that backstabs everyone to get ahead, kisses ass of superiors, treats their spouse or partners like crap because they are so stressed and often neglect them or abuse them either physically or a verbally? Or is it the person that will not be pushed around, bossed around, that tell people to kiss their ass without a thought of the consequences? Is it a guy that wears makeup or a girl that don't and cuts her hair short? To me I believe the only normalcy in society is that everyone is abnormal in some sense of what society believes the norm should be.

OK so let's look at it like this. Society tries to quell our individualism and tries to make us a part of the mass. The ones that fight and express their own individualism may be trashed by society or even killed or persecuted or shunned or banished from society but in the end, we win because we held onto that individualism and uniqueness that is the human spirit instead of just becoming another tool for the masses.

But normal is relevant. No one is normal. They may seem so from the outside but you can bet your ass they are not socially normal inside with every aspect of themselves.

One of the problems that I see with the mental health professionals is that very few of them understand or even have degrees in psychology. Most have degrees in social work or counseling and even psychiatrists have very little working knowledge of psychology. Mental illness is not the problem, it is the people that we let treat it that know nothing about how the mind works in the way of psychology that is the problem. I can sit and talk to anyone. I don't charge anyone a dime. I have no degrees in social work or counseling. I do know a little about psychology, metaphysics and so on. I don't want to get paid to care or act like I care. I cannot give anyone a diagnosis of their mental problems and social workers and counselors can't either.

Why is bipolar such a popular diagnosis? Because that is the flavor of the day when it comes to Mental health. It explains manic episodes and depressive episodes. Regardless whether or not both are felt or displayed. It is the easiest thing to diagnose because most people trust these individuals. I am a maniac so I must be bipolar because that is one symptom. Or because I am agitated I must be bipolar and having a manic episode. I am depressed so I must be bipolar because that is a symptom. Yes there are true mental disorders but I think a lot of them are misdiagnosed because of a lack of working knowledge of psychology.

We have a severe mental disorder when we think of life being sane, stable or normal. Life is unpredictable, unstable in that it can be turned upside down in an instant. Sane. Look at all the lunatics among us. Most in governmental or bureaucratically positions or positions of power in corporations that are about as sane as a lunatic. And normal? Well never trade individualism for a position in the mass of society. If life was normal, there would be no fun to it trying to figure it out. It would just be... Boring.

[Taka]

i know there are people who don't like diagnosing everything. if a person is mourning a loved one who died, it suddenly becomes depression if it lasts more than a few days. if a child is energetic, they have adhd, if they are bad at giving the "correct" emotional responses, they're somewhere on the autism spectrum etc.

most mental illnesses are caused by life. if only the initial response, the sadness, anger, frustration, fear, had been treated as natural parts of life, they may not have stayed stuck in the person until it became such a big problem.

i mean, kids even drop out of school because of the social anxiety they develop when failing seems to never be an available option.