conversation on "normal"

[Cynthia13]

Had an extremely cival and interesting conversation today with a woman who knows she is completely judgemental over everyone that doesn't fit her idea of normal. So I started questioning her idea of normal. "What makes your "normal" normal? What does it look like to you? Why is anything outside of your idea somehow "less than" or not normal? What makes your normal right and theirs wrong?" She couldn't give any solid reason, it just was. She did say she knows she's close minded and her thinking is off, but unable / unwilling to look much deeper than that.

So I shared my thoughts... Told her that I've been judged and have no desire to make others feel the way that judgement made me feel. That no one has the right to make another feel less than because they don't measure up to their ideas. Everyone has the right to their opinions, self expression, values, looks, words, feeling,etc. Everyone has the right to be whoever they are. I don't feel her views are right or wrong either. They're just hers based on her experience.

I asked if she'd ever been judged for being herself. She couldn't think of a time so I asked how it would feel if a very thin person judge her based on her weight. If they said she wasn't normal because she carried extra pounds. It is how she present herself to the world, something she owns as part of her self image. The thin person's normal is to be thin hers is to be heavier. Neither right or wrong, just different. She didn't have an answer but understood my point, so some progress

Then I surprised myself... she made a comment about me being open minded and non judging, that it was good and showed me to be an "awesome" person. I looked her right in the eyes and told her that it's because that's the me I allow her to see. That there are things about me that I would never share with her because I know how judgemental she is. She looked a bit shocked but wasn't offended.

Why do people feel the need to judge others? We don't all have to get along and sing around a campfire, we just need to be civil and respectful.
Does putting others inside a "normal" box somehow make them better people? I don't think so... normal is over-rated and quite frankly a bit boring.
Or does it make them easier to control?
Easier to understand and less work than opening your mind to different opinions maybe?

[Cynthia13]

You are brilliant! Love the power of your words.

[LivingTheDream]

I know I am a better driver than most others though!

Experienced the gender example just a few minutes ago actually haha! Was talking about an ex of mine and for some reason said would've been with her sexually. He knows what is going on with me but when I said that he was all like, you can't do that, you can't flip flop, make up your mind and go with it, questioning my decision to keep going forward transition wise. I replied I can do w/e I want, tried to explain that their is a middle ground, everyones different, etc, but as far as I can tell, he only sees black and white, guy, girl, can't do this or that, and yet says he is open minded afterwards lol.

[Deleted]

I think I know who you were talking about. And i wonder if she was thinking about me, since i was in heavy genderqueer today including eyeliner.

But she is kind to me, so I am cool with it. Probably messes with her head, to see someone of mixed binaries like that.

I really did short my nervous system out today. Oh well.

Thats just normal for me....

HAH?

[Deleted]

Dec 10, 2014 9:51:44 GMT 8 Cynthia13 said:

You are brilliant! Love the power of your words.

Talk about brilliant, that was a rather terrific conversation you had with that closed minded woman. Well done Cynthia! 

[Cynthia13]

She called me last night concerned with how I see her and how she sees herself because of our talks. She values our friendship and is concerned that her ways of thinking damage it in some way.
I told her that I don't judge her, she is who she is and has every right to feel or think what she does, that I'm not in any way saying she should think or feel differently. Only she can decide that. Told her that this isn't going to affect our friendship because I accept her for whoever she is, I'm not asking her to change.
She said she sees there's a problem but doesn't know how to fix it. I told her to spend some time with herself and start questioning those judgemental thoughts that pop into her head. "Are they factual or opinion? Why does this bother her? Is it any of her business? Does it reflect somehow on her? Is anyone being hurt by it?"
She thinks I'm a better "Christian" than her which I find amusing considering my thoughts on religion. She's trying and thinking so maybe there's more progress.
The comment I made about not sharing things because I feel she will judge me did hit a chord with her. She doesn't think she would, but questioned it herself. I said that she shouldn't take that one on, that it was my opinion and I couldn't read the future to know how she would react so I err on the side of caution for me. I let her know I didn't mean to hurt her by saying that and she was actually glad I did because it made her question all of this.

[Ayla]

Cynthia

Your friendship and respect have had more impact on your friend than most anything else that she has read, been taught or had experienced. Modeling behaviours. Walking the talk. Being present, honest and authentic is powerful stuff. She is going to keep coming back to you until she thinks that she is ready for you to share something with her that she is confident that she will not judge. You have done a very good thing here. She is on her own journey, she will grow and she will cause others to grow in a similar way.

Safe travels

Aisla

[TDude]

I had a quote on my previous profil saying:

"normal dosen't exist, its an illusion people try to reach,

but nobody is normal, only people pretending to be,

they must life there live in fear of there secret to be discovered.
-
as being dignosed as a child, I was from an early age told that I was "abnormal" Not even the doctor could give me a precise dignose for sure, Even when I got one, as people should, it was "unspecific" tecnically meaning. you are not normal but we dont know exactly in which way?

I think this have shapen my view on Normal. 
growing up learning you arn't normal by definition, both been positive and negative, but I feel
even when I went to special class where people would accept you being "not normal" Alot of people
still wanted to be Normal. I was one of this kids who had thoughts on what Normal is. I did not know what
"Normal-schools" was like, Just that my school was not normal. I had the view that there was more people in the class, and they did not eat by a dinner table, that what I been told and seen on Tv but beside these I had no idear what Normal was, just that it somehow "the typical thing, and the best where the "better type of human beings goes to school"

the main diffrent being raised in a normal vs abnormal box is the expectations and how people view you. 
as Stella young said so well.. "I want to live in a world where we don't have such low expectations of disabled people that we are congratulated for getting out of bed and remembering our own names in the morning." 
I feel this sentence show the fact how people who on the positive point can recive extra help if they are dignosed as "non-normal", but with the expectation that they are never going to be as good as everyone ells, and all the steps they take are from a low standard. 

All this changed when I got into a normal school and the sociaty viewing me as normal.
Here there where no such things as extra help, you survive or die. 
its depressing in the fact that if you do need extra help with something (and we are all humans being) then its not an option, On the other hand you are being aknowlegde alot more and people dont have the same low expectations, they may even have high expectations if you fit well in the normal box of "being popular, good at school, having a girlfriend bla bla bla"
Going to normal school was way more "normal" than I thought. I had expected people to be alot diffrent than me, but meeting so many diffrent type of people show that there is not that much of a diffrence.

In a period I really liked going to normal school, I do enjoy it and I cant relate being seen as how I been dignosed which I never use beside explaining the same things im trying to talk about here.
However the last few years I have started to become critical on what the Normal culture is like. When I was "abnormal" clearly seen as trans, dignosed, and everything, people would not expect me to fufill a certain pattern to play a good part in the sociaty. Not having an expectation that I would become anything special kinda gave me abit more space to be myself and not fitting in a box, But when you fit into the box of being normal, theres also alot of expectations to stay in that box, and if you dont you will get shamed and lose your privilige. its difficult to explain but in one way the expectation to stay normal and survive in this game can also be sufficating and make you do things you infact dont want to. Ex I belive alot of transpeople can relate to trying to live in a genderole they wasnt confortable with, just to "fit in".

I think alot of people never thought of normal as this thing where you are in a power position but it is. If you are viewed as "normal" then it means you are more priviliged and got more power over those which are not seen as "normal". Normal is typical translated into "this is common" but in reality "normal" comes out of "norm" not decribing how common something is, but more on how we see the world.

If you are in the normal group then you may fear to lose your privilige, and you may not experience how it like to be the diffrent one. I think this fear and ignorance of certain groups or topics is what make people react bad toward others. I still find her reaction fairly positive. When you admit you have an issue with something, then you also have the option to get into it and change. pretty much all people have prejugdes or been in situations where we got to step down on others which for us is less priviliged or seen as "diffrent from us" but when we acknowlegde we did so, we can start asking all the big questions or why we do so, educating ourself on what it means, and how we could change our bad behaviours into better ones. 
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[Ayla]

Dec 11, 2014 3:23:32 GMT 8 TDude said:

..."I think alot of people never thought of normal as this thing where you are in a power position but it is. If you are viewed as "normal" then it means you are more priviliged and got more power over those which are not seen as "normal". Normal is typical translated into "this is common" but in reality "normal" comes out of "norm" not decribing how common something is, but more on how we see the world.

If you are in the normal group then you may fear to lose your privilige, and you may not experience how it like to be the diffrent one. I think this fear and ignorance of certain groups or topics is what make people react bad toward others. I still find her reaction fairly positive. When you admit you have an issue with something, then you also have the option to get into it and change. pretty much all people have prejugdes or been in situations where we got to step down on others which for us is less priviliged or seen as "diffrent from us" but when we acknowlegde we did so, we can start asking all the big questions or why we do so, educating ourself on what it means, and how we could change our bad behaviours into better ones. "
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I agree. Abnormal is any behavior that differs from the norm which defines those at the top of the pyramid - which are in the main, white, Anglo Saxon, tertiary educated, wealthy, conservative males