[ti]question[/ti]Does a broader meaning of 'heteronormativity' exist?

[Olivenbaum2014]

Hello,

I hope I'm at the right place here with my question.

I'm writing a small essay for are polyamory community.
During the first order of thought, among other things, I tried to define the notion of heteronormativity. In doing so, I searched the Internet for the specification of this term. Although I have found many things, but the definition is always limited to the question of gender, etc.





In German, at least for me and my friends, the term heteronormativity is used also more generally (even if the origin is clear).


I have always understood heteronormativity as the normativity of heteronomous ideas in the sense of 'uniform'.





Have I always confused something or does this broader meaning of heteronormativity actually exist?

Tank you in advance.

[EchelonHunt]

Heternormativity is the belief or assumption that all people are heterosexual, or that heterosexuality is the default or "normal" state of human being. It tends to complement and accompany concepts like cisnormativity, gender binarism, and gender essentialism. A heteronormative society operates on the assumption that heterosexuality and specific gender features are the human "default." These assumptions can be hurtful because they are stigmatizing and marginalizing, making people who are LGBT+ feel like they are perceived as deviant or unnatural.

The concept of heteronormativity can exist on both a societal and individual level. On a societal level, heteronormativity takes the form of denying marriage equality and same-sex adoption. On an individual level, it can take a form of unintentionally inaccurate assumptions-- such as assuming that a woman is referring to a man when she mentions a spouse or fiance.

The term heteronormativity traces its origins to the early 90s, when it was popularized by Queer Theory expert Michael Warner in "Fear of a Queer Planet." It is a portmanteau of "hetero-" meaning opposite, as in heterosexual, and "normativity," meaning a system of normative assumptions.

Source: The Queer Dictionary - Definition of "Heternormativity"

[Olivenbaum 2014]

Thank you.

I know this definition very well I hope.

The challenge of my question is, I think, the definition of the term and how to generalize the meaning, that is, to use it pars pro toto.



'Hetero' means in ancient Greek, among other things 'different'.



That is why I find it so difficult to explain my use of heteronormativity, which means - pars pro toto - the normativity of already familiar, existing, well-known and accepted practices.



My question is, if anyone knows the usage of this broader meaning of heteronormativity.

[Avery]

Heteronormativity refers to sexuality and this is the accepted meaning. Words and their meanings often change and adapt over time but right now this is pretty much the only way it is used officially (I studied gender studies).

The term for trans* is cisnormativity, but if you are looking for a broad term, to refer to folks who fall in line with societal expectations in all areas, it wouldn't be heteronormativity

[Olivenbaum 2014]

Apr 25, 2018 22:23:19 GMT 8 Avery said:

Heteronormativity refers to sexuality and this is the accepted meaning. Words and their meanings often change and adapt over time but right now this is pretty much the only way it is used officially (I studied gender studies).

The term for trans* is cisnormativity, but if you are looking for a broad term, to refer to folks who fall in line with societal expectations in all areas, it wouldn't be heteronormativity.

Ok. I will have to accept that my use of this term was simply wrong. I will have to find an another term for this kind of normativity, maybe in fact cisnormativity because it can be taken literally as 'normativity of on this side of'.

A quetion. You identify trans* with cisnormativity what I can't understand. I thought that trans* and cisgender are contradictory (or they term contradictory facts), which is why trans*normativity and cisnormativity should by contadictory (or they term contradictory facts). Or am I at a loss?

[Olivenbaum 2014]

PS: I have forgotten an important point in my question: Of course, I have problems basically with the understanding of the identification of trans* and cisnormativity. Since the first one designates a certain sexual identification, while the other one designates primarily a normativity.
But maybe you meant trans*normativity and cisnormativity and my English is not up to scratch .

[EchelonHunt]

Transgender isn't a sexual identification, it is gender and mainly deals with gender incongruence - transgender people have a gender identity that doesn't match the body, the incongruence is the mismatch between brain and body.

Transgender means the person does not identify with the gender/sex they were assigned at birth.

Cisgender means the person does identify with the gender/sex they were assigned at birth.

Gender is who you go to bed as. Sex is who you go to bed with.

It is a very important distinction to make.

It would help to just describe exactly what section you are talking about in your essay for the polyamory community. Why is heteronormativity coming into play? Wouldn't you be better off discussing monogamy since society is heavily endorsing monogamy as the norm that everyone should follow?

[Avery]

Cisnormativity is society's tendency to say that cis is the only normal or valid type of gender just like heteronormativity means that society says that heterosexuality is the only normal or valid sexuality

What exactly are you trying to study?

[Olivenbaum 2014]

Apr 26, 2018 18:33:48 GMT 8 EchelonHunt said:

Transgender isn't a sexual identification, it is gender and mainly deals with gender incongruence - transgender people have a gender identity that doesn't match the body, the incongruence is the mismatch between brain and body.

Transgender means the person does not identify with the gender/sex they were assigned at birth.

Cisgender means the person does identify with the gender/sex they were assigned at birth.

Gender is who you go to bed as. Sex is who you go to bed with.

It is a very important distinction to make.

It would help to just describe exactly what section you are talking about in your essay for the polyamory community. Why is heteronormativity coming into play? Wouldn't you be better off discussing monogamy since society is heavily endorsing monogamy as the norm that everyone should follow?

Thank you for the correction.

The difference between sex and gender is clear to me, at least as it was a part of my studies (but it is a long time ago now): In principal sex as biological assignement, gender as cultural assignement. (Is it still like this?)

In case, you think, I suppose that trans* is a sexual identification: I don't.

But I'm not sure if you understood what I did not understand about your identification. (You said: "The term for trans* is cisnormativity".)

Monogamy or even 'mononormativity' is in fact a term I thougt about. It describes a special fact but not as general as I need it. Cisnormativity could also be a good term, but then I would have to explain the verbal use in contrast to its existing and common definition.
(I will try to think out loud:) What I think about is a kind of 'normativity of the uniform' and at the same time of a normativity of what already exists and has been acclimated for a long time. So at one hand it is a social claim for beeing the same as the one that claims. On the other hand it is a social claim for staying the same, for not changing. Both are ultimately uniformity, only the former describes the adaptation to the requestor/claimer/demander (whatever the english word is), the second adaptation to habits. Despite their differences, both types of normativity agree that it is a demand for adaptation to the existing. I need a term that includes both.

[Olivenbaum 2014]

Apr 26, 2018 19:44:11 GMT 8 Avery said:

Cisnormativity is society's tendency to say that cis is the only normal or valid type of gender just like heteronormativity means that society says that heterosexuality is the only normal or valid sexuality

What exactly are you trying to study?

I am now in the paragraph of my essay, where I assert and explain why nonconformist everyday behavior (confrontating known and unknown people) is unpleasant, why it is so and what you could do, so that it is no longer unpleasant.

So maybe 'normativity of conformity' is a good term to.

[Avery]

Unless you are talking about social biases in favour of cisgender people don't use the term cisnormativity.

I am still extremely unclear as to what you are looking for here. If it's not about trans people we aren't linguists. If it is about trans people we have already told you what the terms mean

[Avery]

If your topic is so broad I think you just mean social conformity, as in confirming to social rules and norms

[Olivenbaum 2014]

Apr 28, 2018 1:16:24 GMT 8 Avery said:

If your topic is so broad I think you just mean social conformity, as in confirming to social rules and norms

Yes, exactly. 

It could also be the term: 'heteronomy'. Even though this term does not express/address the aspect of 'claiming' (what 'normativity' does), it nevertheless implies an influence of the 'hetero' (other) on the individual. 

So what I see now is that heteronormativity and heteronomy address different meaning of hetero. While heteronormativity presupposes a specific and binary use of hetero (the other sex / gender), heteronomy makes use of broader and not binary meaning of hetero (the other).

I think now that my confusion derives from the two different meaning of hetero. 

And what I wanted all the time was heteronormativity with the same hetero meaning as in heteronomy.

[Olivenbaum 2014]

Apr 28, 2018 1:15:36 GMT 8 Avery said:

Unless you are talking about social biases in favour of cisgender people don't use the term cisnormativity.

I am still extremely unclear as to what you are looking for here. If it's not about trans people we aren't linguists. If it is about trans people we have already told you what the terms mean

Then people of different disciplines think only in the conceptual horizon of their respective discipline?

And besides, I remember that gender studies students were very good linguists - probably for a good and obvious reason

[Avery]

Sure, if this was a page for gender studies students, but this is a page for trans and genderqueer individuals, many of us have never taken gender studies. I have, and that's why I am the one replying to you.

I think you should reflect on the fact that you came to a social support network and expected trans people to put in the emotional and intellectual labour to teach you about linguistics when it has no bearing or benefit on our lives. It's not that I am unwilling to help educate people, but you took a very privileged, entitled approach and even resisted what we were telling you. It is not the job of minorities to teach the privileged majority and you should think about that next time you have questions. Try to figure it out with the vast numbers of articles and information sources, or go a forum or website for linguists or academics, not a support network for trans people.

We use this page to build community and support each other and celebrate our transitions and stay alive, not to define terms for cis academics.

The real lesson here is not linguistics, it is that you need to think about what you are walking into, what you are taking for granted, what privileges you have, and what other options there are before you ever ask marginalized people to teach you.