Delusions of Gender by Cordelia Fine

[EchelonHunt]

^{(Seems to be different covers depending where you look)}

Has anyone read this book? It seems interesting, I have found an online PDF of the book (down below)

"This is a vehement attack on the latest pseudo-scientific claims about the differences between the sexes - with the scientific evidence to back it up.

Sex discrimination is supposedly a distant memory. Yet popular books, magazines and even scientific articles increasingly defend inequalities by citing immutable biological differences between the male and female brain.

Why are there so few women in science and engineering, so few men in the laundry room? Well, they say, it's our brains.

Drawing on the latest research in developmental psychology, neuroscience, and social psychology, "Delusions of Gender" rebuts these claims, showing how old myths, dressed up in new scientific finery, help perpetuate the status quo.

Cordelia Fine reveals the mind's remarkable plasticity, shows the substantial influence of culture on identity, and, ultimately, exposes just how much of what we consider 'hardwired' is actually malleable.

This startling, original and witty book shows the surprising extent to which boys and girls, men and women are made - and not born."

“Cordelia Fine has a first-rate intellect and writing talent to burn. In her new book, Delusions of Gender, she takes aim at the idea that male brains and female brains are ‘wired differently,’ leading men and women to act in a manner consistent with decades-old gender stereotypes. Armed with penetrating insights, a rapier wit, and a slew of carefully researched facts, Fine lowers her visor, lifts her lance, and attacks this idea full-force. Whether her adversaries can rally their forces and mount a successful counter-attack remains to be seen. What’s certain at this point, however, is that in Delusions of Gender Cordelia Fine has struck a terrific first blow against what she calls ‘neurosexism.’” (William Ickes, author of Everyday Mind Reading: Understanding What Other People Think and Feel)

“In Delusions of Gender Cordelia Fine does a magnificent job debunking the so-called science, and especially the brain science, of gender. If you thought there were some inescapable facts about women’s minds―some hard wiring that explains poor science and maths performance, or the ability to remember to buy the milk and arrange the holidays―you can put these on the rubbish heap. Instead, Fine shows that there are almost no areas of performance that are not touched by cultural stereotypes. This scholarly book will make you itch to press the delete button on so much nonsense, while being pure fun to read.” (Uta Frith FBA, FMedSci, FRS; Institute of Cognitive Neuroscience, University College London)

Click to read Delusions of Gender PDF 

(Supplied by www.sexnotgender.wordpress.com - yes the website name raised my eyebrow, it has a lot of transgender stuff though unsure what to think, what do you think of the website? )

[Deleted]

I haven't read the book, and since it's being advertised on this website, I might not bother. I looked at a sample of the articles here and found a fair bit of anti-trans nonsense. It's the usual stuff: they don't actually understand transgenderism or the positions that transpeople take on various issues. One little example: one article seems to think that we transpeople think that being cisgender means that you're happy with your assigned gender role in society. Wonder where they got that idea?

I don't know that I'll explore this site any further. I do get tired of this kind of stuff.

[EchelonHunt]

Yeah, I thought it was weird that this book was listed under the "Brain Sex Does Not Exist" Link on that website.

I mean, there's been a lot of research done on brain scans, especially that of transgender folks. It seems pretentious to claim "Brain Sex Does Not Exist" because {Insert published books here by feminists}

I read some of the book and by golly, there was a lot and lot of mumble jumble to crawl through then they mentioned transguys,

"Yet even today, the evidence suggests that it would be a shrewd career move for a woman to disguise
herself as a man. People who have transformed their identity in this way – namely, female-to-male
transsexuals – report decidedly beneficial consequences in the workplace."

So, what, is the author trying to imply that female-to-male transsexuals are simply women disguised as men or am I reading too much into it? And what's with the outdated term?

And to top it off, they are stating their "you were born a boy, socialised as a boy, therefore you are a boy." opinions as facts and "material reality". Even going as far as telling a transwoman in the comments that her writing style "tactic" is very male and therefore refutes her statement of not being socialised as a boy.

I can't even... god damn. I thought Dirtwhiteboi was bad, this takes it to another level entirely.

[Deleted]

No, Jacey, you've got it right. "People who have transformed their identity in this way--namely, female-to-male transsexuals . . .": that is the typical misunderstanding of cisgender people (particularly those who are hostile to transgenderism) regarding transgenderism.  And in the brief look I had at this website, I saw a lot of that sort of stuff.

The information I've read indicates to me beyond a shadow of a doubt that there are real neurological differences between men's and women's brains. But this is not, repeat not, a justification for gender stereotypes or for enforcing gender roles.  Even if there are broad similarities among women, the infinite variety among individuals makes it meaningless.  And let's say that it can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that women on the whole aren't as good at math as men.  That doesn't in any way mean that women who are good at math should be barred from the profession.  Nor does it mean that if a woman is better at sociology than math, she has to go into sociology.  If she prefers to get into math because she likes it better, she should have the freedom to do so.  She may not have as successful a career in math as she would have had in sociology, but it's still her choice.  Doing something you like is extremely important, and nobody, male or female, should be forced into something they don't want to get into.

This notion that differences in the brain must be used to determine people's paths in life is mistaken.

[Shan]

What I like most about my own life is that I have freedom of choice and I can do or be anything I wish as long as it doesn't bring harm to someone else. Here's the rub, too many people would like to express their opinions about how my choices are affecting them. I think that we can all agree that these complaints are really the crux of the problem for many who allow themselves to become emotionally subjugated by the constant chorus of concerns by others who think they are somehow hurt by our own personal life choices which in reality in no way affects them. I say, be all you can be and live life as you wish to the fullest.

[Kira]

There does seem to be an erroneous conflation of the 'brain wired gender' and 'brain wired gender roles and behaviours' concepts in the whole 'nurture not nature' argument.

[Deleted]

You're right, Kira. This is something I've noticed--that whenever cisgender academicians are talking about gender, they're never talking about the same thing we are. Sometimes I agree with what they're saying, but they're still not talking about gender in our sense. And that's why they quite often argue against transgenderism: they think they're talking about "transgender gender", but they're not.

[Taka]

any book that says gender is not in the brain, is a book that i most likely won't find worthwhile at all.

we already know that androsexuality can be tested for.
kind of expensive test, and mostly interesting for science only.
but certain parts of the brain light up when androsexual people smell testosterone.

there is also a tiny part of the brain that develops differently between male and female persons.
luckily that can't be tested while a person is alive (yet), but it seems like that part of transsexual people's brains develop as is normal for the gender they say they are instead of what one would expect based on more visible clues.

but of course. that may just be socially constructed as well.
cause we all know that social constructs are easy to beat out of a child, unless they're so strong headed that no social pressure can stop them from defying everything that society tries to force them to become...

if transgenderism is real, then brain gender must be as well, or everything will just stop making sense.

_____________________________

we also had this funny tv program once, made by a comedian who's also a sociologist (made it difficult to do serious interviews with people on the street...),
where he talked to both scientists and sociologist about gender, child rearing, and other things that have to do with whether we are created by society or if we might actually be born the way we turn out in the end.
as a sociologist, he was surprised to find that the social construct he'd learned so much about, actually seemed to be a whole lot of biology as well, when he read a range of studies on all kinds of things.

one of the interesting things he found was that identical twins who grow up separate from each other often turn out completely identical, down to the cigarette brand they smoke. (while those who grow up together will have more differences. likely because they need to mark themselves as not the other twin.)
if society could shape a person as much as those people say, it really doesn't make sense for identical twins who never knew each other until adulthood, to be completely identical in pretty much every aspect when they find each other.

[Deleted]

Mar 7, 2016 6:36:09 GMT 8 Taka said:

there is also a tiny part of the brain that develops differently between male and female persons.
luckily that can't be tested while a person is alive (yet),

Actually, Taka, there are plenty of our enemies who'd be delighted to experiment on it if they were allowed to, if you see what I mean.  I assume (correct me if I'm wrong) that you're referring to the bed nucleus of the stria terminalis.

In any case, I'd like to thank you, Taka, for this post, and you, Jacey, for this thread.  This has given me lots to think about.  Rather than replying here, which might perhaps derail the thread, I've decided to try and organize my thoughts, get them all down in proper order.  So I've posted them here:

nonbinary.proboards.com/thread/5498/jacey-taka

if anyone's interested.

[Taka]

many would love to study it. luckily those who use and own the equipment often worry about ethics, and wouldn't let just anyone meddle.
and i think that may be the one. not good at remembering what those little bits and pieces are called.