What price are you willing to pay to be trans?

[EchelonHunt]

Ok, I love you all but I'm going to have to put on my Admin Voice and address some issues because there is some seriously poor self-moderation going on in this thread.

*clears throat* Ahem, Admin Voice activated.

Julie, be the bigger person and walk away when a thread gets off-topic. Don't make threats and don't bite the bait. 

Shan, sometimes there can be a thin line between being honest and being a jerk - people can have issues telling the difference due to their skewed perceptions. FYI, I don't think you are being a jerk. I understand how you feel though, you aren't alone. You have a creative way of illustrating your thoughts. You have a valid point and I agree that there is always consequences to one's actions but be mindful and respect that people may disagree. That others have different perspectives of the price or what it means to be trans, even if it sounds like rubbish to you.

Edge, try not to focus on the terms Shan has used and instead focus on reading in-between the lines, see what Shan is really trying to say. Refrain from making assumptions about another person, just use your observation skills. It took a few re-reads myself to understand where, not just Shan but where everyone is coming from.

Ativan, you aren't above Julie, we are all on equal standing here. Please refrain from bringing up old topics (e.g. Susans), if you have issues with who Julie associates with outside of this forum or their history with the other forum, suck it up and deal with it. 

Ativan & Julie, both of you attacking each other for posting your own truths, isn't this silly and childish? We can only speak of our own experiences because that is all we have to offer. If neither of you are willing to respect the other's experiences, wisdom and insight you both can offer to the forum, I will kick both of you out.

I don't want to have to resort to that because I like both of you but if it comes down to it, I will do it.

Both of you, get your shit together or I will do it for you.

Aisla & Trinity, thank you for trying to contain the madness and apologies to Trinity for the thread getting derailed.

*Ahem* Admin Voice deactivated.

The price I'm willing to pay? Everything, my entire being.

All actions, even inaction have consequences. The butterfly effect, if you will. 

"It has been said that something as small as the flutter of a butterfly's wing can ultimately cause a typhoon halfway around the world."

[Deleted]

Jacey gets an amen on their assessment of this entire thing and I will be taking that as wise advice!

[Edge]

I did use my observation skills. I observed how I and others said that we're trans regardless of price. It is something we were born as and something we are. There was no "Hmm. I'm going to be trans because I'm willing to pay the price" or "I can suddenly not be trans because I'm unwilling to pay the price." It was "Oh. I'm trans. What are my options?" I observed how we were then told we were wrong and insulting terms were used to describe our experiences. Those aren't assumptions. It's written pretty clearly.
I'll stop focusing on terms when Shan apologizes for them. Until then, she is responsible for the insults she chose to use.

[Deleted]

Apr 11, 2015 1:05:50 GMT 8 Edge said:

I did use my observation skills. I observed how I and others said that we're trans regardless of price. It is something we were born as and something we are. There was no "Hmm. I'm going to be trans because I'm willing to pay the price" or "I can suddenly not be trans because I'm unwilling to pay the price." It was "Oh. I'm trans. What are my options?" I observed how we were then told we were wrong and insulting terms were used to describe our experiences. Those aren't assumptions. It's written pretty clearly.
I'll stop focusing on terms when Shan apologizes for them. Until then, she is responsible for the insults she chose to use.

Of course we are dear and I never said otherwise and there will be no apologies forthcoming. I was responding to the title of the thread which asks, "What price are you willing to pay to be trans?" There is nothing insulting in acknowledging that being trans and following through with transition does indeed come at great price for many. If you wish to remain insulted that is your prerogative, I won't post on this thread any further as I have worn myself out trying to clarify what the meaning of [IS] is all to no avail. 

[Deleted]

OK so I got two cents. No I didn't choose to be trans. I did for a few years choose to hide it. But that was miserable. I can choose to see the positive sides of it or the negative sides of it.

To me if it did come down to an actual choice, looking back now, then I would probably choose to be trans. Hypothetically of course. If I were cis, then I may have ended up being a closeminded hateful individual that see's their life as being the only right way to live. I may have been a bigot like so many other's are or turned out to be where I grew up. Looking back though. I am trans. It has caused me some struggles and pain but... It has allowed me to be open minded to how other's want to live their lives. It has made me accepting of other's lives and willing to be friends with anyone regardless of views or beliefs or sexual orientation or gender identification or race or anything else. It has pretty much wiped out any feelings of hate for anyone even those that may hate me. Oh I can still be disappointed and disgusted but I can't hate anyone except under some very specific circumstances and even that I try to work on.

Believe me, I have paid my dues and everyone else has too. But like Aisla said we all come from different back grounds, financial situations, geographical areas, and the biggest is our own life experiences. I try to see the positive side and like Shan, I am kind of happy that I am trans and can live both in one. I think it has pretty much made me who I am today. Without it, who knows who I would be. What would have influenced my thinking and emotions. Of course it has cost me friends, family members and job opportunities. But instead of working for someone else I worked for myself and now others work for me.

I think the question would probably be better worded something like, "What price would you pay to have been born the physical sex of your preferred gender?" For that I would pay any price except for one thing. 

[Deleted]

I appreciate the sentiment but my feelings have nothing to do with the topic. And the topic is about lives that are affected by us, including our own.

So the question remains.

Given that trans is not a choice, and that we are all trans, what are we willing to and going to do about it, and what will the effect be on us or others when we take the actions?



If it's played out then cool. If more sharing was desired, have at it.

Trin.

[Deleted]

Apr 11, 2015 19:15:22 GMT 8 Trinity said:

I appreciate the sentiment but my feelings have nothing to do with the topic. And the topic is about lives that are affected by us, including our own.

So the question remains.

Given that trans is not a choice, and that we are all trans, what are we willing to and going to do about it, and what will the effect be on us or others when we take the actions?



If it's played out then cool. If more sharing was desired, have at it.

Trin.

Trinity, there are always prices to pay and trade offs in life. It's not about a trans thing or even a cis thing. We have to decide. Is where we want to go with ourselves or the path we want to walk worth the price we may have to pay or what we may have to trade in order to be happy? This is really something that isn't a black or white answer or experience. Love hurts when love is lost and then when you find another that is deeper and more than what the old love was then that is a good thing. But losing that love will hurt and will make it seem like the world is ending. This is just an example. It can be careers or anything else. There is always something better and there may not be anything better, but my experience has led me to believe always go up and not dwell on lost things or the prices you have to pay.

But there is always a price to pay and there is always a trade off. We have to decide whether or not we are willing to pay or trade what we know and what feels comfortable.

OK so the topic you are talking about, we do affect the lives of others and others affect our lives. Unfortunately this is a human condition. It comes down to what choice that you make in order to live with yourself. I made my choice and ended my marriage. I just couldn't fake it anymore. I wasn't happy and therefore she wasn't happy. So I lost a wife but in the process I found myself again. Now I can be happy and am free to express myself the way I see fit without fear of ridicule. Not to mention that I have full freedom to make my own business decisions without someone that has no vision for the future except working for someone else. So I paid the price and lost a wife but also bought total freedom to do and be who and what I want to be without hearing all about the fear of taking chances. So I made the right decision for me but for me alone. Everyone else has to make their own decisions. And yes we tend to hurt people and people tend to hurt us. This is just life.